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Why Haven't We Shot Down Spy Balloon?

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  • Originally posted by seanD View Post

    Much like they made up the story about Russians paying bounties for American body bags in Afghanistan to make Trump look bad (and that Biden used against Trump and his so-called appeasement of Putin) that changed after the '20 election.
    I believe it was the defense department that said they could not verify that story.

    Comment


    • Oddly enough, the DoD is one agency that I would not expect to always tell the truth. Some of their official statements are meant to bluff adversaries.

      Having said this, this current business about previous balloons is bizarre. China (of course) is claiming that this has never happened before. I wouldn't expect them to back up the DoD.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

        "But it happened to Trump, too!" is classic deflection. This incident made Joe look like a complete moron, so the White House is doing anything it can to try and polish his turd of an image.
        Well, Joe didn't act like Donald "I know better than the generals" Trump.

        And he didn't act like my dog would: "It's in my territory, I must attack now!"

        But I don't think that really makes him look bad. YMMV

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Stoic View Post

          I believe it was the defense department that said they could not verify that story.
          The story that the DoD had records of Chinese spy crafts over the US multiple times yet didn't notify the Trump admin leaves lingering questions as to why they weren't notified of this. Why, that even seems to imply a "deep state" of sorts. I'd rather assume the easier route -- it's certainly not fantastical to believe government officials lie. They lied about it the first time. Former intelligence officials called out their lie. Then they had to revise the story accordingly.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by seanD View Post
            The story that the DoD had records of Chinese spy crafts over the US multiple times yet didn't notify the Trump admin leaves lingering questions as to why they weren't notified of this. Why, that even seems to imply a "deep state" of sorts. I'd rather assume the easier route -- it's certainly not fantastical to believe government officials lie. They lied about it the first time. Former intelligence officials called out their lie. Then they had to revise the story accordingly.
            It looks like you would rather believe they lied, even if there is no reason to think so.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Stoic View Post

              It looks like you would rather believe they lied, even if there is no reason to think so.
              It looks like you'd rather believe there is a deep state within the DoD that keeps important international information from the POTUS. Yes, I'll choose they lied.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                The spokesgeneral said they took measures to disable it's ability to gather intel. I assume that means they probably shot some sort of EMP at it to fry the electronics.

                “Currently, we assess that this balloon has limited added value from an intelligence collection perspective, but we are taking steps, nevertheless, to protect against foreign intelligence collection of sensitive information,”

                But I agree they should have shot it down before it got into our airspace. That they didn't makes us look weak to the Chinese, or incompetent. Maybe we didn't even know about it until someone spotted it over the USA?

                I think one reason the Chinese sent it was to gauge our reaction. Biden showed weakness. Even Obama would have shot the thing down over unpopulated land, or before it got to our shores, and then reamed out the Chinese for attempting to invade our airspace.
                Weren't they still controlling where to floated over it? Wouldn't that take electronics?

                Comment


                • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

                  Biden followed the advice if the military not to shoot down the balloon over land. The military deterrmined that the balloon did not represent an intelligence threat to US military bases and facilities, and yes, disabled the electronics of the craft.

                  This type of balloon transported device is terribly low tech. Everyone has sophisticated satellites including the Chinese far more capable than anything transported on a balloon. Calling it a 'spy balloon' is clearly hyperbole. I can get more information on the whole earth through google maps then this WW II technology. .
                  Let's think about this logically: do you really suppose China would have flown this balloon over multiple top secret military sites if they didn't have something to gain? If you really think that giant array suspended from the balloon was comparable to World War II technology, then you're delusional.

                  As for the military assuring us that they limited the balloon's intelligence gathering capabilities, I'm not buying it since it was still clearly under China's control for the duration of its flight. You know what would have really limited its intelligence gathering capabilities? If we had shot it down before it entered US air space!
                  Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                  But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                  Than a fool in the eyes of God


                  From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Stoic View Post

                    Well, Joe didn't act like Donald "I know better than the generals" Trump.

                    And he didn't act like my dog would: "It's in my territory, I must attack now!"

                    But I don't think that really makes him look bad. YMMV
                    Clearly the best course of action was to allow China to collect as much intelligence data as they possibly could before shooting the balloon down over the ocean and rendering it unrecoverable.

                    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                    Than a fool in the eyes of God


                    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

                      Clearly the best course of action was to allow China to collect as much intelligence data as they possibly could before shooting the balloon down over the ocean and rendering it unrecoverable.

                      Not only that, but now they know they can send another similar craft only weaponized and the delay in action would allow it to successfully deploy its objective.

                      I'm still mystified why this became official at the outset without them even attempting to try and cover this up. To me, that's the bigger story.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by seanD View Post

                        It looks like you'd rather believe there is a deep state within the DoD that keeps important international information from the POTUS. Yes, I'll choose they lied.
                        I don't think it's considered keeping something from POTUS if they don't know about it themselves.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Stoic View Post

                          I don't think it's considered keeping something from POTUS if they don't know about it themselves.
                          You just said (in fact emphasized it here multiple times) you accept the theory that they had records of this information they could search and recall. If they have records, then someone in the DoD obviously knew the crafts were there, yet didn't bother notifying the president or any intelligence official in his admin at the time. And if they knew these crafts were from China (and I see no reason not to think that) makes that implication even worse.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                            If you really think that giant array suspended from the balloon was comparable to World War II technology, then you're delusional.
                            All I could make out from the fuzzy photos were a few rows of solar panels. Probably a camera and some other electronics in the center.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by seanD View Post
                              You just said (in fact emphasized it here multiple times) you accept the theory that they had records of this information they could search and recall. If they have records, then someone in the DoD obviously knew the crafts were there, yet didn't bother notifying the president or any intelligence official in his admin at the time. And if they knew these crafts were from China (and I see no reason not to think that) makes that implication even worse.
                              The data can be there without anyone actually knowing what it means.

                              So your conclusion that someone in the DoD obviously knew the crafts were there is faulty.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

                                Clearly the best course of action was to allow China to collect as much intelligence data as they possibly could before shooting the balloon down over the ocean and rendering it unrecoverable.

                                If it poses zero threat, then even a tiny chance of hurting Americans tips the risk-benefit analysis in favor of waiting, without even considering the possibility that we can gain useful information by studying it in action.

                                Comment

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