UK woman arrested for silently praying across from abortion clinic

[rogue06]

No.... she giggles, not cackles.... a perfectly delightful sound.

Giggles can be infectious

Cackling, OTOH

[Hypatia_Alexandria]

I have no reason to doubt that you have a large library.

So why make silly insinuations?

[rogue06]

OK, then, so say something now.

Would you kick a stranger out of your field is s/he was just praying? Yes? or No?

I've thought about this since you first posed the question. I look back over the years at how I've responded to people on my yard and figure that most likely my reaction would have been to tell them to leave when they finished. And if they were still there after several minutes I'd let them know they had a reasonable time to finish and it was time for them to leave.

Although, considering where I live, I'd be more inclined to tell them to move on because to be on my property means to be standing on my door step. A bit too close for comfort.





So has it finally sunk in that there is a difference between public property, where the public has a right to be, and private property, where such access is much more restricted?

[Sparko]

c73bc2ed-aa22-442d-88cc-cba3c9ea546c.jpg

Yes!

[Sparko]

All any government needs to do is allow (or even provoke) civil unrest to the point where the population will accept martial law - after that, the final blow is only a formality. Hitler made use of the technique before he became chancellor. Gangs of thugs, answerable to him, running riot. Laws introduced to put a stop to the problems, and giving him more power than he ordinarily would have had. And the public acquiesced because "now" was better than "then." (to forestall: yes it is an oversimplified account of a very complex situation.)

You would need to convince the military to go along with it. And in the USA I don't think a rogue president could do that. I

The only way to keep your constitution (or anyone else's) in force is through vigilance.

That is true. Which is why most Americans won't give up their guns even if the government makes them illegal, and why conservatives are so concerned with the way liberals are indoctrinating our children.

[Sparko]

I did wander back through the early posts because I think that you linked the PSPO document for that site, but I never did find it.

I'll have another look around....... I can't answer you until I have found it.

https://www.birmingham.gov.uk/downlo...n_road_b30.pdf

[rogue06]

Yes!

You can promise to take more naps than old Joe.

A promise you can depend on!


And we can demand that bacon go back to like it was before the war.

A promise you can depend on!

[rogue06]

[eider]

I've thought about this since you first posed the question. I look back over the years at how I've responded to people on my yard and figure that most likely my reaction would have been to tell them to leave when they finished. And if they were still there after several minutes I'd let them know they had a reasonable time to finish and it was time for them to leave.

Although, considering where I live, I'd be more inclined to tell them to move on because to be on my property means to be standing on my door step. A bit too close for comfort.


So has it finally sunk in that there is a difference between public property, where the public has a right to be, and private property, where such access is much more restricted?

Sunk in? It has sunk in that your ideas about freedom are much stranger than mine. I don't mind folks praying anywhere....... where I live the action of Trespass is not criminal, cannot be arrested, carries no record.
Again...... I'm sad that on occasions buffoons can get to write laws and orders. From the beginning I have told that this person's presence was enough.

[eider]

https://www.birmingham.gov.uk/downlo...n_road_b30.pdf

Thank you for that....
And ...Yes....... in this case she was arrestable as soon as she entered the area. She has a past history of demonstrating at and being at such venues for 18 years.
The Police wanted to speak with her about previous incidents.

PC:- I'll ask you once more, will you voluntarily come to the police station with me to answer some questions about today and further days where there are allegations that you have broken public space orders?
She refused. He arrested her.

The order which you showed reads:- ‘Protesting’ means being in the restricted area (whether by yourself or with others)....' and since this woman had a previous history, and since she couldn't give a lawful reason for being there........ she was 'being there'...... loitering.

Some other PSPOs (Manchester area) havev a different PSPO and groups of more than three persons are not allowed, but this order excluded that phrase.

[CivilDiscourse]

Thank you for that....
And ...Yes....... in this case she was arrestable as soon as she entered the area. She has a past history of demonstrating at and being at such venues for 18 years.
The Police wanted to speak with her about previous incidents.

PC:- I'll ask you once more, will you voluntarily come to the police station with me to answer some questions about today and further days where there are allegations that you have broken public space orders?
She refused. He arrested her.

The order which you showed reads:- ‘Protesting’ means being in the restricted area (whether by yourself or with others)....' and since this woman had a previous history, and since she couldn't give a lawful reason for being there........ she was 'being there'...... loitering.

Some other PSPOs (Manchester area) havev a different PSPO and groups of more than three persons are not allowed, but this order excluded that phrase.

I still love the use of the term "voluntarily" here. Come with us voluntarily, or we will arrest you and take you with us.

You have two choices Eider, you can either voluntarily give me your wallet, or I will shoot you and take your wallet.

[Diogenes]

Thank you for that....
And ...Yes....... in this case she was arrestable as soon as she entered the area. She has a past history of demonstrating at and being at such venues for 18 years.
The Police wanted to speak with her about previous incidents.

PC:- I'll ask you once more, will you voluntarily come to the police station with me to answer some questions about today and further days where there are allegations that you have broken public space orders?
She refused. He arrested her.

The order which you showed reads:- ‘Protesting’ means being in the restricted area (whether by yourself or with others)....' and since this woman had a previous history, and since she couldn't give a lawful reason for being there........ she was 'being there'...... loitering.

Some other PSPOs (Manchester area) havev a different PSPO and groups of more than three persons are not allowed, but this order excluded that phrase.

Do you now concede prayer is included as a form of protest and therefore prayer is criminalised?

[rogue06]

Sunk in? It has sunk in that your ideas about freedom are much stranger than mine. I don't mind folks praying anywhere....... where I live the action of Trespass is not criminal, cannot be arrested, carries no record.
Again...... I'm sad that on occasions buffoons can get to write laws and orders. From the beginning I have told that this person's presence was enough.

But merely standing on the other side of the road, silently praying can get you arrested.

[rogue06]

I still love the use of the term "voluntarily" here. Come with us voluntarily, or we will arrest you and take you with us.

You have two choices Eider, you can either voluntarily give me your wallet, or I will shoot you and take your wallet.

Kind of like how we make a "contribution" to Social Security. See what happens to you if you were to decide not to "contribute."

[Sparko]

You can promise to take more naps than old Joe.

A promise you can depend on!


And we can demand that bacon go back to like it was before the war.

A promise you can depend on!

Biden is the one who wears Depends.