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UK woman arrested for silently praying across from abortion clinic

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  • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

    They generally don't stay long, especially when they spot the bull coming across the pasture.

    So, this rancher saw a man climbing over his fence into his pasture, and approached the man to tell him to stay out.
    The man produced a nice shiny badge, and said, "see this badge? I am a federal agent with the US Department of Agriculture, and this badge allows me to go anywhere I want to go".
    The rancher shrugged, and the man climbed over the fence and started walking across the pasture.
    When he was about 20 yards from the fence, he noticed a large menacing bull slowly approaching, snorting and lowering his head.

    The man called to the rancher... "Uh... what do i do?"

    The rancher replied "show the bull your badge!"


    I used to travel all over the place...... we have thousands of public footpaths scattered all over, and some are not marked, but I would take an ordnance survey map with me. One day a person challenged me and I explained that I was on a public footpath and needed to continue, so this person (probably the farmer) told me that a big bull was in the next field. ..........
    I told him that if that was true then the farmer would have a very expensive and stressy experience very soon after.... I kept walking....... he had been lying!

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Sparko View Post

      Well they wouldn't be arrested for praying but for blocking traffic and endangering lives. In this case the woman was arrested for silent prayer and the officer confirmed that. It wasn't for "loitering"
      Huh? She needed to be questioned her about previous incidents, didn't he?
      Yeah..... sure he did. He told her so.

      I'm sad that these folks included prayer of any kind in this PSPO, I think they are bonkers.....total nutters, but there you have it.
      Simply being there without cause should have been enough..... but I won't be writing to the PM about it; these Conservatives have some very strange ideas, you know.

      I must look up that PSPO which I think you showed us (?) about 100 pages back to see what it is included.



      Comment


      • Originally posted by eider View Post
        I simply asked a question. You brought up all the sex stuff.


        You actually got that right. And then the back peddling started from you!



        And again, here you are trying to scurry in to a sex offender at a school. My example is simply a person praying silently outside a school or playground.
        To quote myself, with added emphasis:

        Originally posted by Diogenes View Post

        Seeing as they are alternative reasons for someone to loiter around a school than prayer, yeah, I would think someone praying around a school is a bit weird. It's not immediately illegal to loiter or pray in front of a school.
        Is it or should it be illegal to pray in front of a school? No. Do schools have unique risks? Yes. Is it possible that a sex offender would appear to pray in front of a school in order to have access to children? Yes. I'm concerned that you think the criminal history of a sex offender (ostensibly a child molester given the scenario of a school) is equatable to the criminal history of praying for the unborn being terminated in a clinic.

        Seeing as I'm now quoting myself and you refuse to accept I answered merely praying outside of a school is not illegal, I'm done.
        P1) If , then I win.

        P2)

        C) I win.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by eider View Post

          So you'd go out and confront a person for silently praying in your field? Oh dear!
          First off, I did not say that, but rather pointed out that isn't public property.

          Second, do you understand the difference between public and private property? Or this there some huge difference in how those concepts understood over there in Limeyland as compared to here in 'Murica?

          I'm always still in trouble again

          "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
          "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
          "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

          Comment


          • Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
            You seem to think it is important to continually to regale us with the size of your library to the point of exaggerating it for whatever strange reason.
            Are you trying to pretend you have access to my home?

            I only refer to my own personal library when you [or others] make these peevish and childish comments.

            Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
            You've been caught padding your list with books that don't cover what you thought they did,
            You will need to provide some examples, with of course extensive quotes from those alleged texts that prove they "don't cover what" I "thought they did". [N.B. "extensive" means a great deal more than six lines]

            Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
            and of course there was the time I pointed out that every single book that you quoted from over the course of a couple of days was available online.
            To which I replied along the lines of "So what?" Hundreds of books are online either in their entirety or as partial texts. It might do you good to read some of them. However, I also cite texts that [I suspect] are not available online.

            So perhaps you might honestly address the following:
            1. Why do you find it so difficult to accept that over my lifetime [and I suspect we are of an age] I have acquired a large and extensive personal library?
            2. You repeatedly insinuate that I only ever use texts that are online Why?
            "It ain't necessarily so
            The things that you're liable
            To read in the Bible
            It ain't necessarily so
            ."

            Sportin' Life
            Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

            Comment


            • Originally posted by eider View Post

              Huh? She needed to be questioned her about previous incidents, didn't he?
              Yeah..... sure he did. He told her so.

              I'm sad that these folks included prayer of any kind in this PSPO, I think they are bonkers.....total nutters, but there you have it.
              Simply being there without cause should have been enough..... but I won't be writing to the PM about it; these Conservatives have some very strange ideas, you know.

              I must look up that PSPO which I think you showed us (?) about 100 pages back to see what it is included.


              Absolutely specifically mentions prayer as one of the possible offenses.
              The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post


                To which I replied along the lines of "So what?" Hundreds of books are online either in their entirety or as partial texts. It might do you good to read some of them. However, I also cite texts that [I suspect] are not available online.

                So perhaps you might honestly address the following:
                1. Why do you find it so difficult to accept that over my lifetime [and I suspect we are of an age] I have acquired a large and extensive personal library?
                2. You repeatedly insinuate that I only ever use texts that are online Why?
                I have no reason to doubt that you have a large library. I also have no reason to doubt that you Google a great deal and then act like it came from your library

                Personally, I don't understand why, but there you go

                I'm always still in trouble again

                "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                Comment


                • Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                  First off, I did not say that, but rather pointed out that isn't public property.

                  Second, do you understand the difference between public and private property? Or this there some huge difference in how those concepts understood over there in Limeyland as compared to here in 'Murica?
                  Yeah, I think it's coming clear.

                  What you doin' in ma field?
                  Just praying.
                  Now you get on outa here this ma private property I gotten rights...... You go on off and get in them thar streets.


                  Sweet.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

                    Absolutely specifically mentions prayer as one of the possible offenses.
                    Yes, I know it does....... they even passed a specific bill to emphasis 'no praying' only last week. Can't wait to get rid of these Conservative nutjobs.
                    Sparko doesn't think that loitering was included in the document.
                    I mentioned all this to my wife and she giggled loudly....dreadful giggler, my Missus. She mimicked a situation:-

                    I'm a Cop, so what are doing here? I hope you're not praying!
                    No.... No sir.... we ain't praying'
                    So what are you actually doin' here?
                    We just.... loitering.
                    Loitering? Oh that's ok then, you just carry on here.

                    I must stop sharing all these conversations with my wife, her merriment is not good, I tell you.


                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by eider View Post

                      Yeah, I think it's coming clear.

                      What you doin' in ma field?
                      Just praying.
                      Now you get on outa here this ma private property I gotten rights...... You go on off and get in them thar streets.


                      Sweet.
                      People have the right to be on public property. They don't have the right to be on private property (unless the owner has granted access to the public like with a shopping center or store).

                      You really aren't very good at this are you?

                      I'm always still in trouble again

                      "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                      "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                      "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by eider View Post

                        Yes, I know it does....... they even passed a specific bill to emphasis 'no praying' only last week. Can't wait to get rid of these Conservative nutjobs.
                        Sparko doesn't think that loitering was included in the document.
                        I mentioned all this to my wife and she giggled loudly....dreadful giggler, my Missus. She mimicked a situation:-

                        I'm a Cop, so what are doing here? I hope you're not praying!
                        No.... No sir.... we ain't praying'
                        So what are you actually doin' here?
                        We just.... loitering.
                        Loitering? Oh that's ok then, you just carry on here.

                        I must stop sharing all these conversations with my wife, her merriment is not good, I tell you.

                        The law is against PROTESTING in the area around the abortion clinic. Not standing there, not walking through it, not chatting with your friends, Not feeding the pigeons. PROTESTING. And then it lists various things that are considered protesting, which included prayer. Now I expect that it meant praying out loud, not in your head. But now it seems to include praying in your head.

                        But no where is "loitering" considered PROTESTING in the PSPO law. If you disagree please provide a source for that.

                        Here I will get you started:

                        Public Spaces Protection Orders
                        Guidance for councils
                        https://www.local.gov.uk/sites/defau...dance_06_1.pdf

                        I did see this in there though:
                        Limitations
                        There are some limitations set out in the
                        legislation regarding behaviours that can
                        be restricted by PSPOs. Under the 2014
                        Act, local authorities must have regard to
                        the freedoms permitted under articles 10
                        and 11 of the Human Rights Act 1998 when
                        drafting, extending, varying or discharging an
                        Order. These cover freedom of expression,
                        and freedom of assembly and association
                        respectively


                        Which seems to kind of negate the whole idea of PSPOs, since freedom of expression and freedom of assembly would include such things as protesting peacefully in the area. And banning prayer seems to go against the human rights act.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Sparko View Post

                          Which seems to kind of negate the whole idea of PSPOs, since freedom of expression and freedom of assembly would include such things as protesting peacefully in the area. And banning prayer seems to go against the human rights act.
                          As we are seeing more and more often, freedom of expression and assembly are what the government tells us what they are and only apply when you agree with them.

                          I'm always still in trouble again

                          "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                          "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                          "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                            As we are seeing more and more often, freedom of expression and assembly are what the government tells us what they are and only apply when you agree with them.
                            The biggest problem is how they wrote the Human Rights act of 1998. They give everyone freedoms then basically take them away in the next breath with "exceptions".

                            Take Article 10, mentioned above:

                            Article 10

                            1.Everyone has the right to freedom of expression. This right shall include freedom to hold opinions and to receive and impart information and ideas without interference by public authority and regardless of frontiers. This Article shall not prevent States from requiring the licensing of broadcasting, television or cinema enterprises.

                            2. The exercise of these freedoms, since it carries with it duties and responsibilities, may be subject to such formalities, conditions, restrictions or penalties as are prescribed by law and are necessary in a democratic society, in the interests of national security, territorial integrity or public safety, for the prevention of disorder or crime, for the protection of health or morals, for the protection of the reputation or rights of others, for preventing the disclosure of information received in confidence, or for maintaining the authority and impartiality of the judiciary.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by eider View Post

                              Yes, I know it does....... they even passed a specific bill to emphasis 'no praying' only last week. Can't wait to get rid of these Conservative nutjobs.
                              Sparko doesn't think that loitering was included in the document.
                              I mentioned all this to my wife and she giggled loudly....dreadful giggler, my Missus. She mimicked a situation:-

                              I'm a Cop, so what are doing here? I hope you're not praying!
                              No.... No sir.... we ain't praying'
                              So what are you actually doin' here?
                              We just.... loitering.
                              Loitering? Oh that's ok then, you just carry on here.

                              I must stop sharing all these conversations with my wife, her merriment is not good, I tell you.


                              The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Sparko View Post

                                The biggest problem is how they wrote the Human Rights act of 1998. They give everyone freedoms then basically take them away in the next breath with "exceptions".

                                Take Article 10, mentioned above:

                                Article 10

                                1.Everyone has the right to freedom of expression. This right shall include freedom to hold opinions and to receive and impart information and ideas without interference by public authority and regardless of frontiers. This Article shall not prevent States from requiring the licensing of broadcasting, television or cinema enterprises.

                                2. The exercise of these freedoms, since it carries with it duties and responsibilities, may be subject to such formalities, conditions, restrictions or penalties as are prescribed by law and are necessary in a democratic society, in the interests of national security, territorial integrity or public safety, for the prevention of disorder or crime, for the protection of health or morals, for the protection of the reputation or rights of others, for preventing the disclosure of information received in confidence, or for maintaining the authority and impartiality of the judiciary.
                                Yup.

                                You have freedom of expression except until such time the government decides you don't.

                                I'm always still in trouble again

                                "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                                "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                                "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                                Comment

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