If Christian Nationalism Succeeded

[tabibito]

If you just read G-Mark's very clear account then you won't be so muddled, imo.

It is muddled only to a person who is not familiar with the way the Jewish calendar works and how time references work. If today is Friday, the next day will be Saturday - which starts at nominally 6pm. "In the morning" is a minimum twelve hours after the start of the day until noon midday. The first hour is either a reference to the time between 6pm and 7pm with "of the night" being optional, or the first hour of the morning, between 6am and 7am. The writer or speaker will usually expect the audience to have enough nous to work out which is referred to from context. Noon is 3pm. If "daybreak" is used, it refers to the break where day one becomes day 2 - 6pm on day 1.

Demonstration:[indent]
A write that up using the Koine Greek conventions:
On the first day a cyclone warning was issued. The next day, the cyclone hit the city, destroying much of it, and in the morning the devastation could be seen.
The reader unfamiliar with the KG conventions might consider that the cyclone had struck the day after the warning was issued with the devastation becoming apparent the day after the cyclone had struck, but to summarise the actual sequence of events:

December 24, a cyclone warning is announced.
December 25, 2am the cyclone strikes the city [cyclone made landfall around 10 pm on the 24th, but full force in the city itself wasn't until 2am]

by 5am an estimated 80% of the city is destroyed

After 6am (dawn), the devastation could be seen

Now compare that with Mark
[on the first day] Jesus left Jerusalem and went to Bethany. The next day he left Bethany and returned to Jerusalem, cleared the temple and returned to Bethany for the night. In the morning he returned to Jerusalem.
Mark doesn't even say, "the next morning:" he says, "in the morning."

Can you show me your sources for the above information?

Ask a Samaritan when the Passover sacrifice is conducted, he's likely to tell you that it is at the "dawn" (quote marks included) of the 14th, (he might even add) 12 minutes or so before nightfall. It was that question and answer that allowed me to work out what is happening in the Biblical record. Of course, Personal correspondence via email is not a citable source.

I don't know that there are any: working with the Jewish terminology is a matter of taking the time and effort to understand how the time references work. Most theologians know that the Jewish Calendar day begins at 6pm, but they don't consider the implications. Jews are well accustomed to working with two calendars, so they tend not to think of the problems that arise for people who aren't.

[eider]

[QUOTE=tabibito;n1440884]


You wrote:-
No doubt you also think that the Jewish leaders who approached Pilate to ask for the tomb to be guarded waited until the morning after Jesus was interred before doing so. In reality, they went to Pilate the next day - the minimum delay could conceivably have been as little as half an hour.

I asked:-Can you show me your sources for the above information?

Ask a Samaritan when the Passover sacrifice is conducted, he's likely to tell you that it is at the "dawn" (quote marks included) of the 14th, (he might even add) 12 minutes or so before nightfall. It was that question and answer that allowed me to work out what is happening in the Biblical record. Of course, Personal correspondence via email is not a citable source.

No source for your claims there, then.

I don't know that there are any: working with the Jewish terminology is a matter of taking the time and effort to understand how the time references work. Most theologians know that the Jewish Calendar day begins at 6pm, but they don't consider the implications. Jews are well accustomed to working with two calendars, so they tend not to think of the problems that arise for people who aren't.

......... So you just made all that up?
I'll see you later...........

[tabibito]

[QUOTE=eider;n1441311]

You wrote:-
No doubt you also think that the Jewish leaders who approached Pilate to ask for the tomb to be guarded waited until the morning after Jesus was interred before doing so. In reality, they went to Pilate the next day - the minimum delay could conceivably have been as little as half an hour.

I asked:-Can you show me your sources for the above information?

How so very H_A of you. When the date changes from one day to the next, from the perspective of the first day, the second is the next day. In the common calendar , that happens at midnight, in any of the Hebrew calendars, it happens at 6pm. What sources for such a basic concept do you expect to be available? The provided example of how it works would be enough to give any reasonable person pause.

No source for your claims there, then.

As I said, none that are citable.

......... So you just made all that up?

If it comforts you to think so, go ahead.

[eider]

[QUOTE=tabibito;n1441323]

How so very H_A of you. When the date changes from one day to the next, from the perspective of the first day, the second is the next day. In the common calendar , that happens at midnight, in any of the Hebrew calendars, it happens at 6pm. What sources for such a basic concept do you expect to be available? The provided example of how it works would be enough to give any reasonable person pause.

Again:- You wrote :
You wrote:-
No doubt you also think that the Jewish leaders who approached Pilate to ask for the tomb to be guarded waited until the morning after Jesus was interred before doing so. In reality, they went to Pilate the next day - the minimum delay could conceivably have been as little as half an hour.

I asked:-Can you show me your sources for the above information?

All you had to do was show:-
Matthew {27:62} Now the next day, that followed the day of the preparation, the chief priests and Pharisees came together unto Pilate, {27:63} Saying, Sir, we remember that that deceiver said, while he was yet alive, After three days I will rise again. {27:64} Command therefore that the sepulchre be made sure until the third day, lest his disciples come by night, and steal him away, and say unto the people, He is risen from the dead: so the last error shall be worse than the first. {27:65} Pilate said unto them, Ye have a watch: go your way, make [it] as sure as ye can. {27:66} So they went, and made the sepulchre sure, sealing the stone, and setting a watch.

.......... which I don't believe at all, not at all. Magdalene never saw any of that bunch. Matthew just made stuff up, I think.

[tabibito]

Again:- You wrote :
You wrote:-
No doubt you also think that the Jewish leaders who approached Pilate to ask for the tomb to be guarded waited until the morning after Jesus was interred before doing so. In reality, they went to Pilate the next day - the minimum delay could conceivably have been as little as half an hour.

I asked:-Can you show me your sources for the above information?

All you had to do was show:-
Matthew {27:62} Now the next day, that followed the day of the preparation, the chief priests and Pharisees came together unto Pilate, {27:63} Saying, Sir, we remember that that deceiver said, while he was yet alive, After three days I will rise again. {27:64} Command therefore that the sepulchre be made sure until the third day, lest his disciples come by night, and steal him away, and say unto the people, He is risen from the dead: so the last error shall be worse than the first. {27:65} Pilate said unto them, Ye have a watch: go your way, make [it] as sure as ye can. {27:66} So they went, and made the sepulchre sure, sealing the stone, and setting a watch.

.......... which I don't believe at all, not at all. Magdalene never saw any of that bunch. Matthew just made stuff up, I think.

So then - I was clearly not making things up. Admittedly though, I should have said "in reality, [either Matthew or] the Biblical record says ..."

Trying to work out where Mary of Magdala comes into the picture in that pericope.

"the next day" can of course mean "during daylight hours of the next day" as readily as "some time after 6pm" - but "next day [x happened] and in the morning [y]" is a clear reference to the same day, as in the cyclone example.

[rogue06]

[QUOTE=eider;n1441311]

......... So you just made all that up?

More delicious unintended

IRON--E.jpg

from the man who has pretty much offered up nothing but stuff he makes up.

[eider]

"the next day" can of course mean "during daylight hours of the next day" as readily as "some time after 6pm" - but "next day [x happened] and in the morning [y]" is a clear reference to the same day, as in the cyclone example.

How muddled........ !!!

[tabibito]

More delicious unintended

IRON--E.jpg

from the man who has pretty much offered up nothing but stuff he makes up.

It is only Christians who are required to provide sources: in the event that they are provided, will be mocked.

Also, there isnee much cause to believe that a person can who considers a simple statement muddled - as here

"the next day" can of course mean "during daylight hours of the next day" as readily as "some time after 6pm" - but "next day [x happened] and in the morning [y]" is a clear reference to the same day, as in the cyclone example.

- has any hope of understanding what he reads in scripture. But he will pronounce himself qualified to give exposition anyway.