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Colorado Springs LGBT Nightclub Shooting; At Least 5 Dead, 18 Injured

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  • Originally posted by seer View Post

    Stop it FF, you had no reason to accuse us in the first place.
    What accusation have you dreamt up now?
    “I think God, in creating man, somewhat overestimated his ability.” ― Oscar Wilde
    “And if there were a God, I think it very unlikely that He would have such an uneasy vanity as to be offended by those who doubt His existence” ― Bertrand Russell
    “not all there” - you know who you are

    Comment


    • Originally posted by firstfloor View Post

      What accusation have you dreamt up now?
      Here are two to start with, but there are more...

      The hatred promoted by at least one notorious poster on this website is killing people. Please stop.

      As soon as you consent to fighting a Culture War (war is violent) you give permission for this sort of thing. You know that there are members of your tribe who will take things too far. Like Boebert, you don’t have to pull the trigger to have their blood on your hands.
      Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

      Comment


      • Originally posted by seanD View Post

        I know nothing about this case and how the so-called "hate crime" law is applied, but that would really only make sense if he could somehow get a lighter sentence, unless he was just doing it as a mockery.
        I know that, originally, it was intended as a force multiplier, just like "aggravated" was. But, primarily, I believe it was more of a "look at us - we're doing something important" in adding the "hate crime" descriptor.

        I understand the "aggravated" factor --- breaking into an unoccupied is "breaking and entering" or "burglary", but if the home is occupied, there's a greater chance of injury or death, so that's "aggravated burglary".

        To me, the "hate crime" thing just appears to make something that's already illegal more illegallererer.
        The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

          I know that, originally, it was intended as a force multiplier, just like "aggravated" was. But, primarily, I believe it was more of a "look at us - we're doing something important" in adding the "hate crime" descriptor.

          I understand the "aggravated" factor --- breaking into an unoccupied is "breaking and entering" or "burglary", but if the home is occupied, there's a greater chance of injury or death, so that's "aggravated burglary".

          To me, the "hate crime" thing just appears to make something that's already illegal more illegallererer.
          Not to mention the nebulous meaning it has. It seems "hate crime" can be defined as subjectively as "hate speech." To my initial point, I actually didn't know the state didn't support the death penalty until I looked it up, so now it makes even less sense this is some kind of way to gain sympathy.
          "What am I doing here?" -- Joe Biden 2021

          Comment


          • Originally posted by seanD View Post

            Not to mention the nebulous meaning it has. It seems "hate crime" can be defined as subjectively as "hate speech." To my initial point, I actually didn't know the state didn't support the death penalty until I looked it up, so now it makes even less sense this is some kind of way to gain sympathy.
            Well, yeah, plus "hate speech" and "hate crimes" were originally intended to deal with matters deemed racist - so I supposed this could even be further effort toward equating racism with alleged homophobia stuff.
            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

            Comment


            • X
              “I think God, in creating man, somewhat overestimated his ability.” ― Oscar Wilde
              “And if there were a God, I think it very unlikely that He would have such an uneasy vanity as to be offended by those who doubt His existence” ― Bertrand Russell
              “not all there” - you know who you are

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post

                I've never understood the use of them. Especially in a case like this where he's essentially going to have multiple life without parole sentences when he's found guilty. Like, what does adding 5-10 years for a "hate crime" in a case like this even do?
                Didn't Colorado drop their "without parole" a few years back?

                In any case, unless a Soros-backed candidate becomes Governor who can then commute sentences, this guy will grow old and die in jail.

                I'm always still in trouble again

                "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                Comment


                • Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                  Didn't Colorado drop their "without parole" a few years back?

                  In any case, unless a Soros-backed candidate becomes Governor who can then commute sentences, this guy will grow old and die in jail.
                  For juveniles (which he isnt) and for those who were accessories that were present but not incolved in the killing (someone standing watch for a robbery that ends up with the guy inside killing someone for example). 2016 and I think 2021 respectively.

                  Regular first degree murder(s), it very much still exists.
                  "When you're attacking FBI agents because you're under criminal investigation, you're losing"
                  -Trump Press Secretary, Sarah Huckabee Sanders


                  "So when you actually get the virus, you're going to start producing antibodies against multiple pieces of the virus. So, your antibodies are probably better at that point than the vaccination."
                  - Pfizer Scientist Chris Croce

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post

                    For juveniles (which he isnt) and for those who were accessories that were present but not incolved in the killing (someone standing watch for a robbery that ends up with the guy inside killing someone for example). 2016 and I think 2021 respectively.

                    Regular first degree murder(s), it very much still exists.
                    Glad to hear it.

                    I'm always still in trouble again

                    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                    "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                    "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                      And pretty much irrelevant.

                      The shooter, who identifies himself as non-binary and who's preferred personal pronouns are they/them and goes by "Mx. Aldrich," hardly followed in his father's foot steps.

                      Since they apparently can't find evidence that he is conservative the NYT is instead seeking to try guilt by association -- his father is conservative -- instead of looking at the evidence provided that the shooter is another violent leftist loon.
                      Yep. My uncle is rather conservative; however, his 4 kids are all quite liberal (the oldest is a polyamorous homosexual, and his "art" is performing in drag).
                      Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

                      Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
                      sigpic
                      I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by seer View Post

                        Here are two to start with, but there are more...
                        You might enjoy this series of podcasts by Rachel Maddow:

                        ULTRA

                        1940, The Christian Front, etc.

                        https://www.rachelmaddow.com/rachel-...resents-ultra/

                        … history that I knew nothing about.

                        “I think God, in creating man, somewhat overestimated his ability.” ― Oscar Wilde
                        “And if there were a God, I think it very unlikely that He would have such an uneasy vanity as to be offended by those who doubt His existence” ― Bertrand Russell
                        “not all there” - you know who you are

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
                          Yep. My uncle is rather conservative; however, his 4 kids are all quite liberal (the oldest is a polyamorous homosexual, and his "art" is performing in drag).
                          So 2 votes for “violent leftist loon”.
                          “I think God, in creating man, somewhat overestimated his ability.” ― Oscar Wilde
                          “And if there were a God, I think it very unlikely that He would have such an uneasy vanity as to be offended by those who doubt His existence” ― Bertrand Russell
                          “not all there” - you know who you are

                          Comment


                          • A summary of reactions from the right, so far:



                            After issuing a statement about the shooting, in which she offered her prayers to those affected and called for the lawless violence to end, Representative Lauren Boebert (R-CO) was criticized by some Democratic politicians who accused her of hypocrisy, based on her history of making anti-LGBTQ comments while also blocking gun control laws.[59][60] In their responses to the shooting, several far-right pundits have promoted an LGBT grooming conspiracy theory,[61][62][63][64] as well as perpetuating moral panic.[65][66][67][68]Conservative media personality Tucker Carlsondisplayed a banner on his Fox News program Tucker Carlson Tonight that read "Stop sexualizing kids" while later hosting a guest who said that mass shootings would keep happening "until we end this evil agenda that is attacking children".[69]Reactionary influencer Tim Pool[70][71] responded to the shooting by criticizing the venue's drag show performances, saying, "We shouldn't tolerate pedophiles grooming kids. Club Q had a grooming event";[72] while right-wing commentators Matt Walsh, Candace Owens, Chaya Raichik from Libs of TikTok, and Representative Marjorie Taylor Greeneall continued to publish content targeting LGBTQ people, some of which was focused on the Colorado area.[69][73][62] Walsh accused leftists of weaponizing the shooting to "blackmail [right-wing figures] into accepting the castration and sexualization of children", adding, "These people are just beyond evil. I have never felt more motivated to oppose everything they stand for", while also saying his critics are "Soulless demons". Owens made a similar accusation, claiming that leftists are using the shooting to make conservatives "get on board with experimenting on children’s genitals with puberty blockers", otherwise "nightclub shootings will continue to happen", commenting that "It's so implausibly stupid I had to write it out".[74]Jenna Ellis, a former lawyer for Donald Trump, was criticized for saying that the five people killed during the shooting were "now reaping the consequences of having eternal damnation" due to there being "no evidence" that they were Christians.[75][76] Far-right provocateurs, including Jack Posobiec, have questioned Richard Fierro's presence at the drag show, invoking unfounded transphobic and homophobic insinuations.[77]

                            On November 24, Colorado Springs evangelical ministry Focus on the Family was targeted with a graffiti message, reading: "Their blood is on your hands. Five lives taken." The Focus on the Family organization actively advocates for people to "leave homosexuality" and follow Christ.[disputeddiscuss][78][79][80] According to The Independent, the conservative ministry "has lobbied against LGBT+ rights and characterised LGBT+ identities as 'a particularly evil lie of Satan.'" The Human Rights Campaign has said that they "promote many dangerous ideas, practices and programs that cause real harm to LGBT+ people and their families", while the Southern Poverty Law Center considers the ministry to be a lobbying group that is central to the anti-gay movement of the religious right.[80]

                            https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colo...tclub_shooting

                            All of which is about as grim as it gets. I am very disappointed.
                            “I think God, in creating man, somewhat overestimated his ability.” ― Oscar Wilde
                            “And if there were a God, I think it very unlikely that He would have such an uneasy vanity as to be offended by those who doubt His existence” ― Bertrand Russell
                            “not all there” - you know who you are

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by firstfloor View Post

                              You might enjoy this series of podcasts by Rachel Maddow:

                              ULTRA

                              1940, The Christian Front, etc.

                              https://www.rachelmaddow.com/rachel-...resents-ultra/

                              … history that I knew nothing about.
                              I wouldn't trust Rachel any further than I can throw a bull by the tail.
                              The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by firstfloor View Post

                                You might enjoy this series of podcasts by Rachel Maddow:

                                ULTRA

                                1940, The Christian Front, etc.

                                https://www.rachelmaddow.com/rachel-...resents-ultra/

                                … history that I knew nothing about.
                                We agree with the district court’s conclusion that the broad context of Maddow’s show makes it more likely that her audiences will “expect her to use subjective language that comports with her political opinions.”


                                Because Maddow discloses all relevant facts and employs colorful, hyperbolic language, we conclude that the specific context of the statement does not render it an assertion of fact.


                                Therefore, the medium through which the contested statement was made supports Maddow’s argument that a reasonable viewer would not conclude the statement implies an assertion of fact.


                                A reasonable viewer would be able to differentiate between Maddow’s commentary and the actual news she is reporting.


                                The audience could “accept or reject [Maddow’s] opinion based on their own independent evaluation of the facts” specifically because the undisputed news story is readily distinguishable from Maddow’s commentary.


                                A reasonable person would understand Maddow’s contested statement as an “obvious exaggeration,” Gardner, 563 F.3d at 989, that is, as Maddow explains, “sandwiched between precise factual recitations” of The Daily Beast article.


                                You really shouldn't cite someone who tanked her own credibility in the OANN defamation lawsuit. Source

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