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Muslims Join The LGBTQ fight...

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  • Originally posted by Sparko View Post

    Shuny is playing dumber than usual. He knows what you are asking, and he is avoiding answering it. Because he knows you are correct.
    Of all the Charlie Browns in the world, he is the Charlie Brownest.
    Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

    Comment


    • Originally posted by seer View Post

      Shuny, that is not what I asked - Gay Baha'is are discriminated against within your religion and that is a good thing - correct?
      Asked many useless times and not the issue. The issue is whether the Baha'i Laws and Administration ever apply to non-Baha'is and whether Baha'is could support secular legislation limiting the rights of the LGBT community. Based on scripture the Baha'is believe in the separations religion from secular government, and no the Baha'i Faith nor the followers cannot support this.

      Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
      Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
      But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

      go with the flow the river knows . . .

      Frank

      I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

        Asked many useless times and not the issue. The issue is whether the Baha'i Laws and Administration ever apply to non-Baha'is and whether Baha'is could support secular legislation limiting the rights of the LGBT community. Based on scripture the Baha'is believe in the separations religion from secular government, and no the Baha'i Faith nor the followers cannot support this.
        No, that is not the issue. Bahai has a complete system of government which could grow with it, with local, national and a World house of justice which would control any part of the World that held a large majority of Bahais. Bahai has a written legislation to cover anything from inheritance to matrimony and the World House of Justice has the remit to be able to introduce any new legislation needed so long as it sits in a quorum of five or more members. Bahai has its own Criminal legislation with sentences for offenders, and Bahaullah provided for the security of all with the mention of a police and military force.

        And so Bahai doesn't taker part in secular politics but if it held a majority in a country then it could vote its own system in to being. If Bahai was growing then all the way to power it could insist that it doesn't want to govern, doesn't take part in government......... until it could........and then it would.

        A kind of wolf in sheep's camourflage?

        Comment


        • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

          Asked many useless times and not the issue. The issue is whether the Baha'i Laws and Administration ever apply to non-Baha'is and whether Baha'is could support secular legislation limiting the rights of the LGBT community. Based on scripture the Baha'is believe in the separations religion from secular government, and no the Baha'i Faith nor the followers cannot support this.
          Stop being dishonest Shuny, everyone can see that you are avoiding. I am not asking about secular government. I'm speaking of how Baha'i Laws and Administration apply to Gay Baha'is. And there, it is a good and moral thing to discriminate against homosexuals - correct?
          Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

          Comment


          • Originally posted by seer View Post

            Stop being dishonest Shuny, everyone can see that you are avoiding. I am not asking about secular government. I'm speaking of how Baha'i Laws and Administration apply to Gay Baha'is. And there, it is a good and moral thing to discriminate against homosexuals - correct?
            Asked many useless times and not the issue. The issue is whether the Baha'i Laws and Administration ever apply to non-Baha'is and whether Baha'is could support secular legislation limiting the rights of the LGBT community. Based on scripture the Baha'is believe in the separations religion from secular government, and no the Baha'i Faith nor the followers cannot support this.
            Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
            Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
            But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

            go with the flow the river knows . . .

            Frank

            I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

              Asked many useless times and not the issue. The issue is whether the Baha'i Laws and Administration ever apply to non-Baha'is and whether Baha'is could support secular legislation limiting the rights of the LGBT community. Based on scripture the Baha'is believe in the separations religion from secular government, and no the Baha'i Faith nor the followers cannot support this.
              Currently, they cannot apply to non-Baha'is because they don't have the power to enforce them on others. But they have established a system that will allow them to do so if and when they ever gain control somewhere.

              I'm always still in trouble again

              "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
              "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
              "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

              Comment


              • Originally posted by eider View Post

                No, that is not the issue. Bahai has a complete system of government which could grow with it, with local, national and a World house of justice which would control any part of the World that held a large majority of Bahais. Bahai has a written legislation to cover anything from inheritance to matrimony and the World House of Justice has the remit to be able to introduce any new legislation needed so long as it sits in a quorum of five or more members. Bahai has its own Criminal legislation with sentences for offenders, and Bahaullah provided for the security of all with the mention of a police and military force.

                And so Bahai doesn't taker part in secular politics but if it held a majority in a country then it could vote its own system in to being. If Bahai was growing then all the way to power it could insist that it doesn't want to govern, doesn't take part in government......... until it could........and then it would.

                A kind of wolf in sheep's camourflage?
                That was the issue of separation of religion and state as to whether a religion will impose religious based laws and administration on the whole population regardless of what they believe, Christianity, Islam and Judaism in Isreal do just that. The Baha'i Faith supports the sepertion of religion and state as a fundamental belief in it's scripture. Nothing that you nor others have posted contradicts this,
                Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                go with the flow the river knows . . .

                Frank

                I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

                  Asked many useless times and not the issue. The issue is whether the Baha'i Laws and Administration ever apply to non-Baha'is and whether Baha'is could support secular legislation limiting the rights of the LGBT community. Based on scripture the Baha'is believe in the separations religion from secular government, and no the Baha'i Faith nor the followers cannot support this.

                  Seer wants to know how Baha'i handle gay Baha'i members right now.
                  Last edited by Sparko; 11-25-2022, 10:25 AM.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

                    That was the issue of separation of religion and state as to whether a religion will impose religious based laws and administration on the whole population regardless of what they believe, Christianity, Islam and Judaism in Isreal do just that. The Baha'i Faith supports the sepertion of religion and state as a fundamental belief in it's scripture. Nothing that you nor others have posted contradicts this,
                    Note: The thread started with the misguided appreciation of Muslims in the USA supporting Christians to get laws against the LGBT community. The point is that the Christians and Muslims both do not believe in the separation of religion and state. The author of the thread neglected the fact that the Muslims do not only support laws against the LGBT community, but in their own countries have laws involving capital punishment for the LGBT community. The problem of the separation of religion and state was indeed the issue I addressed concerning the subject of the thread.
                    Last edited by shunyadragon; 11-25-2022, 10:51 AM.
                    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                    go with the flow the river knows . . .

                    Frank

                    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Sparko View Post


                      Seer wants to know how Baha'i handle gay Baha'i members right now.

                      I'm always still in trouble again

                      "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                      "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                      "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
                        Note: The thread started with the appreciation of Muslims in the USA supporting Christians to get laws against the LGBT community. The point is that the Christians and Muslims both do not believe in the se[eratin of religion and state.
                        In the case of Christians, many of us understand that the "Separation of Church and State" is a bogus issue (the way it is misused) based on the letter from Thomas Jefferson to the Danbury Baptist Association.
                        In that case, the intent was that there was no "state religion", but it did not prohibit the church from trying to influence the state wherever it chose to do so.

                        The author of the thread neglected the fact that the Muslims do not only support laws against the LGBT community, but in their own countries have laws involving capital punishment for the LGBT community.
                        Perhaps that "fact" was neglected because we already knew that?

                        The problem of the separation of religion and state was indeed the subject of the thread.
                        To a hammer, every problem looks like a nail?
                        The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

                          In the case of Christians, many of us understand that the "Separation of Church and State" is a bogus issue (the way it is misused) based on the letter from Thomas Jefferson to the Danbury Baptist Association.
                          In that case, the intent was that there was no "state religion", but it did not prohibit the church from trying to influence the state wherever it chose to do so.



                          Perhaps that "fact" was neglected because we already knew that?



                          To a hammer, every problem looks like a nail?
                          OTOH, those of us who had an Algebra teacher in the 9th grade who spent the first fifteen minutes of each and every class extolling the greatness of Sun Myung Moon and had covered the bulletin board with literature promoting his Unification Church, the idea has appeal.

                          I'm always still in trouble again

                          "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                          "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                          "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                            OTOH, those of us who had an Algebra teacher in the 9th grade who spent the first fifteen minutes of each and every class extolling the greatness of Sun Myung Moon and had covered the bulletin board with literature promoting his Unification Church, the idea has appeal.
                            "Education" is one particular area where I have always been consistent, that the focus should be "The Three Rs" (and bacon) and, as you have stated, a student should not even be able to discern where a teacher is politically.

                            Where I have admittedly been inconsistent, was defending a teacher's right to express her religious beliefs, but that was when I was younger and the vast majority of 'religious expression' in a public school would be decidedly "Christian". As Islam became more common, I became aware of the danger of that "religious expression" problem.
                            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

                              Asked many useless times and not the issue. The issue is whether the Baha'i Laws and Administration ever apply to non-Baha'is and whether Baha'is could support secular legislation limiting the rights of the LGBT community. Based on scripture the Baha'is believe in the separations religion from secular government, and no the Baha'i Faith nor the followers cannot support this.
                              Why can't you answer? Seems it's not the asking that is useless, it is the answerer who is useless because he can't answer it.
                              "When you're attacking FBI agents because you're under criminal investigation, you're losing"
                              -Trump Press Secretary, Sarah Huckabee Sanders


                              "So when you actually get the virus, you're going to start producing antibodies against multiple pieces of the virus. So, your antibodies are probably better at that point than the vaccination."
                              - Pfizer Scientist Chris Croce

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post

                                Why can't you answer? Seems it's not the asking that is useless, it is the answerer who is useless because he can't answer it.
                                The issue of the htread was the promotion of laws against the LGBT community NOT the religious beliefs. Seer enthusiastically applauded the Muslims supporting the Christians in this goal. My response was NOT the religious beliefs themselves, but how religions view the separation religion and state. Of cours, seer did not consider Muslims in their own country advocate capital punishment and worse for the LGBT community. I am specifically addressing the subject of the thread as the subject of separation of religon and state which Christians and Muslims do not believe in this principle and the Baha'is by scripture believe in the separation of religion and state.

                                Asked many useless times and not the issue. The issue is whether the Baha'i Laws and Administration ever apply to non-Baha'is and whether Baha'is could support secular legislation limiting the rights of the LGBT community. Based on scripture the Baha'is believe in the separations religion from secular government, and no the Baha'i Faith nor the followers cannot support this.
                                Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                                Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                                But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                                go with the flow the river knows . . .

                                Frank

                                I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                                Comment

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