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The Pope fails to take a moral stand on Russia's invasion of Ukraine

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  • #31
    Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

    As far as atrocities are concerned, Ukraine and Russia are on equal footing. I've been saying from the beginning, there are no good guys in this fight
    Not sure how many Russian civilians the Ukrainians have killed but I'm willing to bet it is far less than the number of Ukrainians that the Russians have killed.

    I'm always still in trouble again

    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
    "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
    "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
      Funny how a Holy Roman Empire rejects the religion of said empire which was supposed to be the part that made it Holy in the first place.
      This does not make sense and does not respond tomy posts concerning the history of Russian imperialist goals of establisng a 'Fatherland' populated by ethic Ruessian throughout the history of Russian going back to the Czars.

      And it's that rejection of the RCC is the reason that both sides in the conflict want the pope to butt out and would regard him as interfering if he got involved. Remember, Roman Catholics only make up 0.1% of the population in Russia (there are literally TWELVE TIMES as many Neopagans and Tengrists living there than Catholics).
      All ready addressed this and you choose to ignore my posts. The issue is not remotely related to the Roman Church population in Russia nor Ukraine The issue is the problematic view of the Pope and the Roman Church and the generation of support for Putin in the West. Putin does not want the Pope to butt out, actually there is no evidence for this, and he loves this defacto support that represent to him a divided view of the West concerning the war. I have seen very little, actually nothing from other members and leaders of the Roman Church in the West speaking out against the Pope's statements. I see a lot of 'Duck, Bob and Weave statements from church leaders, not the Pope to qualify and justify the statements by the Pope, but there is absolutely no justification for the Pope's view that gives credance to the West contribuing to the cause of the imperialist Russian aggression to establish a Russian Fatherland' Empire in Eastern Europe an Asia for ethnic Russians,

      Again . . . this view has no place in an honest, moral and ethical view of the war from the Western perspective, and that of over a billion Roman Church followers in the West that the Pope represents.
      Last edited by shunyadragon; 09-26-2022, 09:45 AM.
      Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
      Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
      But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

      go with the flow the river knows . . .

      Frank

      I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
        Not sure how many Russian civilians the Ukrainians have killed but I'm willing to bet it is far less than the number of Ukrainians that the Russians have killed.
        Let's just put it this way: not all Ukrainian civilian casualties were caused by the Russian army
        Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
        But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
        Than a fool in the eyes of God


        From "Fools Gold" by Petra

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

          Let's just put it this way: not all Ukrainian civilian casualties were caused by the Russian army
          Please provide a reference for this ridiculous one sided undocumented claim. By the facts over 95%+ of all civilian casualties are due to Russian ethnic cleansing, kidnapping, and down right ethnic cleansing in mass of Ukranian civilians including rocket and missile attacks on civilian targets. It is very tragic that you have failed to provide a factual view of the nature of the war against the Ukrainian population for the ethnic cleaning of Ukranians to establish a Russian 'Fatherland' for ethnic Russians in Ukraine.

          The Pope and you are not only the facts of the war, but also egregiously ignoring the history as cited.
          Last edited by shunyadragon; 09-26-2022, 09:55 AM.
          Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
          Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
          But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

          go with the flow the river knows . . .

          Frank

          I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

            This does not make sense and does not respond tomy posts concerning the history of Russian imperialist goals of establisng a 'Fatherland' populated by ethic Ruessian throughout the history of Russian going back to the Czars.



            All ready addressed this and you choose to ignore my posts. The issue is not remotely related to the Roman Church population in Russia nor Ukraine The issue is the problematic view of the Pope and the Roman Church and the generation of support for Putin in the West. Putin does not want the Pope to butt out, actually there is no evidence for this, and he loves this defacto support that represent to him a divided view of the West concerning the war. I have seen very little, actually nothing from other members and leaders of the Roman Church in the West speaking out against the Pope's statements. I see a lot of 'Duck, Bob and Weave statements from church leaders, not the Pope to qualify and justify the statements by the Pope, but there is absolutely no justification for the Pope's view that gives credance to the West contribuing to the cause of the imperialist Russian aggression to establish a Russian Fatherland' Empire in Eastern Europe an Asia for ethnic Russians,

            Again . . . this view has no place in an honest, moral and ethical view of the war from the Western perspective, and that of over a billion Roman Church followers in the West that the Pope represents.
            Yeah. You want one more cheerleader in the west where his voice would be an imperceptible part of the roar and add nothing to it.

            The only place it could have any measurable effect is in Russia and Ukraine where it would be seen as sticking his nose in where it is not wanted. The only reason that they haven't told him to mind his own business so far is because he hasn't interfered.

            Think of it this way... if Australia and New Zealand, for some weird reason, went to war they probably wouldn't be happy if the mullahs in Iran tried to get involved.

            I'm always still in trouble again

            "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
            "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
            "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by rogue06 View Post

              The only place it could have any measurable effect is in Russia and Ukraine where it would be seen as sticking his nose in where it is not wanted. The only reason that they haven't told him to mind his own business so far is because he hasn't interfered.
              Citations needed to support your imaginary view

              Think of it this way... if Australia and New Zealand, for some weird reason, went to war they probably wouldn't be happy if the mullahs in Iran tried to get involved.
              Duck, Bob and Weave with imaginary scenarios does not respond to the subject of the posts.

              Still waiting . . .

              Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
              Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
              But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

              go with the flow the river knows . . .

              Frank

              I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

                Please provide a reference for this ridiculous one sided undocumented claim. By the facts over 95%+ of all civilian casualties are due to Russian ethnic cleansing, kidnapping, and down right ethnic cleansing in mass of Ukranian civilians including rocket and missile attacks on civilian targets. It is very tragic that you have failed to provide a factual view of the nature of the war against the Ukrainian population for the ethnic cleaning of Ukranians to establish a Russian 'Fatherland' for ethnic Russians in Ukraine.

                The Pope and you are not only the facts of the war, but also egregiously ignoring the history as cited.
                No mass graves of Russian civilians and soldiers have been found,
                Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                go with the flow the river knows . . .

                Frank

                I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                  Not sure how many Russian civilians the Ukrainians have killed but I'm willing to bet it is far less than the number of Ukrainians that the Russians have killed.
                  Exact numbers cannot yet be determined until all the mass graves of Ukrainian civilians including women and children have been uncovered in the regions occupied by Russia. The factual evidence indicates that the number is likely wellin to the thousands.

                  There are many heavily populated Russian regions of occupied Ukraine, and there is absolutely no evidence that Russian civilians have been targeted as in the many many artillery and missile attacks by Russians on civilian targets like schools, hospitals, apartment complexes, and shopping malls. Thousands of Russians have moved in to replace Ukrainians made vacant by ethnic cleansing have not been targeted by Ukraine.
                  Last edited by shunyadragon; 09-26-2022, 10:48 AM.
                  Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                  Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                  But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                  go with the flow the river knows . . .

                  Frank

                  I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

                    Please provide a reference for this ridiculous one sided undocumented claim. By the facts over 95%+ of all civilian casualties are due to Russian ethnic cleansing, kidnapping, and down right ethnic cleansing in mass of Ukranian civilians including rocket and missile attacks on civilian targets. It is very tragic that you have failed to provide a factual view of the nature of the war against the Ukrainian population for the ethnic cleaning of Ukranians to establish a Russian 'Fatherland' for ethnic Russians in Ukraine.

                    The Pope and you are not only the facts of the war, but also egregiously ignoring the history as cited.
                    Finding accounts of the atrocities committed by the Azov Battalion is trivial for anybody with an internet search engine. I won't insult your intelligence by doing it for you
                    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                    Than a fool in the eyes of God


                    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

                      Finding accounts of the atrocities committed by the Azov Battalion is trivial for anybody with an internet search engine. I won't insult your intelligence by doing it for you
                      I acknowledge this no problem and you need more beyond this, but . . .

                      Please address the over 1000 fold degree of atrocities committed by Russians as cited in the references against your cold indifference toward the extreme atrocities committed by the Russians you callously compare as equivalent to the atrocities committed by the Ukrainians as equal in posts 9#, #19 and #33.

                      Again corruption is not the issue here since it is committed by oligarch, and governments worldwide.

                      Remember Russia invaded Ukraine with imperialist motives.
                      Last edited by shunyadragon; 09-26-2022, 11:56 AM.
                      Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                      Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                      But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                      go with the flow the river knows . . .

                      Frank

                      I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
                        Citations needed to support your imaginary view

                        Duck, Bob and Weave with imaginary scenarios does not respond to the subject of the posts.

                        Still waiting . . .
                        Well it looks like whatever did a week or thereabouts ago is wearing off

                        I'm always still in trouble again

                        "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                        "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                        "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                          Well it looks like whatever did a week or thereabouts ago is wearing off
                          Citations needed to support your imaginary view

                          Duck, Bob and Weave with imaginary scenarios does not respond to the subject of the posts.

                          Still waiting . . .

                          Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                          Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                          But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                          go with the flow the river knows . . .

                          Frank

                          I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
                            Apparenly, shunya's definition of 'parrots' is 'disagrees with.'
                            Do you agree with the Pope that the West and NATO contributed to the cause of the Russian invasion of Ukraine, and the Italian ex PM that repeated this cause and then supports Russia in the invasion?
                            Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                            Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                            But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                            go with the flow the river knows . . .

                            Frank

                            I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                              Well it looks like whatever did a week or thereabouts ago is wearing off
                              Your confusing meaningless responses were never on the mark to wear off, and it is unlikely you can resolve your problem at the dry cleaners.
                              Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                              Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                              But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                              go with the flow the river knows . . .

                              Frank

                              I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

                                Your confusing meaningless responses were never on the mark to wear off, and it is unlikely you can resolve your problem at the dry cleaners.
                                I'm saying that you had a pleasant return to lucidity for several days there but that appears to have ended.

                                I'm always still in trouble again

                                "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                                "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                                "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                                Comment

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