Stasi Raid Mar-a-Lago

[Stoic]

No. In the scenario you presented, the classification status of the information is immaterial.

The same argument has been made about the classified materials that Trump possessed.

[Stoic]

Executive Order 12958 does not call out SCI information specifically, but it does call out several categories that SCI can fall into. Specifically section 3.3 deals with exemptions to automatic declassification rules but it has been extended by policy to manual declassification as well. SCI can't just be declassified without the written approval of the agency heads of the affected intelligence community.

https://www.justice.gov/archives/ope...sification-faq

IS SENSITIVE COMPARTMENTED INFORMATION (SCI) SUBJECT TO AUTOMATIC DECLASSIFICATION?
Yes. SCI is subject to automatic declassification unless specifically exempted by an approved file series exemption or declassification guide. All SCI information will be referred to the appropriate member(s) of the Intelligence Community for declassification action.

Okay, but an Executive Order is an order by the president, and it's not likely that it will be held that it limits the president himself.

[Bill the Cat]

Okay, but an Executive Order is an order by the president, and it's not likely that it will be held that it limits the president himself.

The EO sets the POTUS as the highest classifying official in the land. We are in this situation for that very reason. It isn't a law so it's harder to hold a POTUS accountable for improper storage.

[Stoic]

The EO sets the POTUS as the highest classifying official in the land. We are in this situation for that very reason. It isn't a law so it's harder to hold a POTUS accountable for improper storage.

Yeah, he's much more likely to be indicted for obstruction than for mishandling classified documents. And that's probably only if his lawyers are willing to turn on him.

[Starlight]

That claim, that the President does not have broad discretionary power when it comes to classification, is central to DOJ's case, so it is has already been made in court.

The DoJ's case does not depend on whether these documents are classified or not. They listed multiple possible legal violations on the search warrant request, and several of those laws do not care about what the classification state of the documents is.

Notable also that the 3-judge appeal court panel, which included 2 judges appointed by Trump, sided entirely with the DoJ in saying they couldn't think of a plausible reason for Trump to have these documents and that the government obviously had a massive interest in analyzing these documents to determine what national security secrets might have been compromised.

[firstfloor]

Cannon changes her order to align with 11th Circuit. Andrew has a full breakdown in the second half of OA633.

https://openargs.com/oa633-why-adnan-was-released/

Meanwhile, American democracy is being beaten to death by Trumpist Republicans.

This summer, an all-Republican county commission in rural New Mexico refused to certify the primary election resultsbecause of unsubstantiated suspicions of fraud. New Mexico’s secretary of state, a Democrat, intervened and asked the state Supreme Court to order the commission to certify the results. Two commissioners relented, but the third, Couy Griffin, refused. He admitted that his suspicion of fraud was not founded on any evidence: “It’s only based on my gut feeling and my own intuition, and that’s all I need.”

- NYTimes

That is just a small sample of what’s going on.

[firstfloor]

BTW, the discussion of court proceedings is at 55mins on OA633.

[firstfloor]

Someone wrote a good comment after Judge Aileen Cannon recently undermined the work of the Special Master in favour of Trump:

Judge Cannon is as corrupt as the fat slug that appointed her.

Unfortunately I have to agree.

[Gondwanaland]

Oooh, getting juicier. Christina Bobb, one of Trump's lawyers and the one who signed the document this summer saying all documents had been returned to the National Archives (which was untrue), is throwing her colleague Evan Corcoran under the bus.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...tify-documents

Trump lawyer told to certify Mar-a-Lago document search she did not conduct





Christina Bobb told justice department on Friday that she signed supposedly complete list of documents at direction of another lawyer, Evan Corcoran


Donald Trump’s lawyer Christina Bobb was instructed to certify to the justice department that all sensitive government documents stored at his Mar-a-Lago resort subpoenaed by a grand jury had been returned, though she had not herself conducted the search for the records.

The certification of subpoena compliance appears to be at the center of a criminal investigation into obstruction of justice surrounding the former US president after the assurance was proved to be untrue when the FBI’s search of the property turned up more than 100 more documents marked classified.

The saga around the Mar-a-Lago documents has become increasingly fraught in the courts as Trump has repeatedly claimed the FBI search and resultant investigation is politically motivated. Meanwhile, the justice department and Democrats have portrayed the taking of the documents as a potentially serious national security breach.

Bobb signed the certification as the “custodian of records” at the direction of another Trump lawyer, Evam Corcoran, only after adding caveats to make the declaration less ironclad since she had not conducted the search herself, according to three sources familiar with the matter.

The certification was drafted by Corcoran, who also searched Mar-a-Lago for documents demanded by the subpoena, and sent it to Bobb before the justice department’s counterintelligence chief, Jay Bratt, arrived on 3 June to collect a folder of responsive records, the sources said.

But unsure as to whether the subpoena had been fully complied with, Bobb told Corcoran to amend the certification to say that “based upon the information that has been provided to me” all documents responsive to the subpoena were being returned after a “diligent” search, the sources said.

It was not clear why Bobb was willing to sign the declaration – as required by the subpoena in lieu of testimony – as the “custodian of records” when she never fulfilled such a role, the sources said, and appeared to know there was risk in attesting to a search she had not completed.

And it was also not clear why Corcoran, who had been liaising with the justice department for weeks over government records at Mar-a-Lago, according to court filings, did not himself sign the certification – as well as whether he had asked for Bobb’s signature.

Bobb testified to the justice department about the 3 June episode on Friday, detailing Corcoran’s role and additional contacts with Trump’s in-house counsel Boris Epshteyn, one of the sources said. NBC News earlier reported Bobb’s testimony.

The circumstance surrounding the subpoena certification has become of special interest to the justice department as it conducts a criminal investigation into possible violations of the Espionage Act, obstruction of justice and the retention of government records.

At issue for the obstruction line of inquiry, according to the partially redacted search warrant affidavit and recent court filings, is whether the letter signed by Bobb was wilful misrepresentation so Trump could hide other documents marked classified at Mar-a-Lago.

“Efforts were likely taken to obstruct the government’s investigation,” federal prosecutors alleged in an August court filing.

But the previously unreported details behind the certification – and accepted as sufficient by the justice department on 3 June – could change the dynamics of the obstruction investigation and minimise Bobb’s potential legal exposure if she was misinformed, former justice department officials said.

The justice department appears to view Bobb and Corcoran as witnesses instead of potential defendants, even if that can change without warning: in a motion to the US appeals court for the 11th circuit, prosecutors wrote that Trump’s lawyers might be “witnesses to relevant events”.

Corcoran did not respond to requests for comment. Bobb and her criminal defense attorney also did not respond to requests for comment, though Bobb has told associates since the FBI’s search of the property on 8 August that the certification she signed was truthful, the sources said.

Bobb is considered as in-house counsel on Trump’s legal team, but was not involved in the Mar-a-Lago documents case in the run-up to the FBI search of the property in Florida and signed the certification as the “custodian of records” in name only, the sources said.

The distinction is important: in signing the statement as a custodian rather than as a lawyer, Bobb might not be subject to attorney-client privilege protections and thus could be able to speak more freely.

[Gondwanaland]

Oooh, getting juicier. Christina Bobb, one of Trump's lawyers and the one who signed the document this summer saying all documents had been returned to the National Archives (which was untrue), is throwing her colleague Evan Corcoran under the bus.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...tify-documents

MAGA - Making Attorneys Get Attorneys

[Mountain Man]

"...according to three sources familiar with the matter..."

[rogue06]

Looks like the J6 Committee is finally realizing that their circus has been a flop, so in a last ditch effort to salvage it before the big top finishes crashing down they voted to subpoena Trump.

Natch the MSM is all giddy over the news.

Meanwhile, in reality, OMB will appeal any such appeal and given the calendar, it is almost certain that the clown show will be forced to close down as the Republicans take control before the appeals run out.

Of course, they will start focusing on the Biden Crime Family which the MSM will decide is horrible for them to do.

[Mountain Man]

...as the Republicans take control...

I'm not entirely confident that will happen. I always think about how everything was breaking Trump's way in 2020, and then suddenly in the early morning of the vote count while we were all asleep, the election suddenly reversed direction. I would not be surprised if it happened again for the midterms.

[firstfloor]

The latest:

The classified documents about Iran and China are considered among the most sensitive the FBI has recovered to date in its investigation of Trump and his aides for possible mishandling of classified information, obstruction and destruction of government records, the people said. The criminal probe is unfolding even as the Justice Department and a district attorney in Georgia investigate alleged efforts by Trump and others to overturn the results of the 2020 presidential election, and as a House select committee has subpoenaed the former president seeking documents and testimony related to those allegations.

- WaPo

[Mountain Man]

Latest twist:

The Department of Injustice recently dropped the empty folders from their list of seized assets (because let's face it, an empty folder is not evidence of anything but an empty folder), and they continue to refuse the request by Trump's lawyers to release the affidavit used to secure the search warrant.

Again, if Main Justice has nothing to hide, then why are they not willing to stand openly behind the predicate for their search.

https://theconservativetreehouse.com...earch-warrant/