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  • Originally posted by Sparko View Post




    You do not do well with your head rolling around on the floor.
    Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
    Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
    But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

    go with the flow the river knows . . .

    Frank

    I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post
      Clearly it isn't fine.
      Comey was fired in 2017. Trump was impeached in 2019. Trump was not impeached for his firing of Comey. Trump was not handicapped wrt Hillary's crimes by anything. Your excuses don't hold water.
      Comey was fired in 2017 after admitting to an active investigation into the Trump fictional Russia collusion story, which included the fake Steel dossier. When that failed miserably, as witnessed by the Mueller Report, the Dem majority immediately shifted gears to the phone call with Zelinski. He was defending himself for his entire Presidency and did not have the FBI at his beck and call. And he was aware that he could not force the FBI or DoJ to indict her if they did not see fit.
      That's what
      - She

      Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
      - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

      I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
      - Stephen R. Donaldson

      Comment


      • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

        You do not do well with your head rolling around on the floor.
        Better than where you keep yours.

        head_up_ass1.jpg

        Comment


        • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

          No other President in history has been accused of taking Classified and Secret documents home after their Presidency is over.
          Given that NBC’s Justice correspondent noted on Today, yesterday that

          "Normally, if an ex-president has documents he shouldn’t have, the government would simply ask for them back."


          indicates that this is not nearly as uncommon as you would have us believe.

          I'm always still in trouble again

          "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
          "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
          "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

          Comment


          • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

            It is a Crime against the USA to have Classified documents illegally in your possession regardless.

            Source: https://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=mcafee&type=E211US1494G0&p=Punshment+for+illegally+possessing+Classified+and+Secret+US+government+documents



            18 U.S. Code § 1924 - Unauthorized removal and retention of classified documents or material


            Whoever, being an officer, employee, contractor, or consultant of the United States, and, by virtue of his office, employment, position, or contract, becomes possessed of documents or materials containing classified information of the United States, knowingly removes such documents or materials without authority and with the intent to retain such documents or materials at an unauthorized location shall be fined under this title or imprisoned for not more than five years, or both.(b)
            For purposes of this section, the provision of documents and materials to the Congress shall not constitute an offense under subsection (a).
            (c)
            In this section, the term “classified information of the United States” means information originated, owned, or possessed by the United States Government concerning the national defense or foreign relations of the United States that has been determined pursuant to law or Executive order to require protection against unauthorized disclosure in the interests of national security.
            (Added Pub. L. 103–359, title VIII, § 808(a), Oct. 14, 1994, 108 Stat. 3453; amended Pub. L. 107–273, div. B, title IV, § 4002(d)(1)(C)(i), Nov. 2, 2002, 116 Stat. 1809; Pub. L. 115–118, title II, § 202, Jan. 19, 2018, 132 Stat. 19.)

            © Copyright Original Source

            He was the declassifiying authority Frank. He could remove them as no longer classified if he chose.
            That's what
            - She

            Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
            - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

            I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
            - Stephen R. Donaldson

            Comment


            • Originally posted by rogue06 View Post

              Given that NBC’s Justice correspondent noted on Today, yesterday that

              "Normally, if an ex-president has documents he shouldn’t have, the government would simply ask for them back."


              indicates that this is not nearly as uncommon as you would have us believe.
              I think people are thinking a president walks out of office carrying boxes of documents, but the truth is more like they had the documents there during their presidency and just didn't return them after they left. Also they are probably copies of documents, not the originals.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post

                Comey was fired in 2017 after admitting to an active investigation into the Trump fictional Russia collusion story, which included the fake Steel dossier. When that failed miserably, as witnessed by the Mueller Report, the Dem majority immediately shifted gears to the phone call with Zelinski. He was defending himself for his entire Presidency and did not have the FBI at his beck and call. And he was aware that he could not force the FBI or DoJ to indict her if they did not see fit.
                You claimed that he was immediately impeached after firing Comey. 2 and a half+ years is not remotely "immediately". Even a year after would be stretching the use of the term "immediately" to the breaking point.

                And his impeachment was not for firing Comey like you also incorrectly claimed.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Sparko View Post

                  I think people are thinking a president walks out of office carrying boxes of documents, but the truth is more like they had the documents there during their presidency and just didn't return them after they left. Also they are probably copies of documents, not the originals.
                  Incorrect. He took them during his move out of the white house/last days IIRC. And they were not copies, they were original documents that the National Archive discovered were missing. As they'd have no way of knowing if Trump made copies, they'd then have no clue that he had them in order to ask for the missing documents. The defenses I'm seeing are getting more and more poorly thought through.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post

                    He was the declassifiying authority Frank. He could remove them as no longer classified if he chose.
                    Which there would be a record of. There would be a record of him declassified said documents. There isn't. In addition once he is out of office he cannot then declassified things.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Juvenal View Post

                      All the reports I’ve seen show the warrant was served low key, with the FBI not even bothering to put on their pretty blue FBI-stenciled jackets. Are you sure you’re not mistaking images of the cops surrounding Mar a Lago after the MAGA nuts showed up, hours after the FBI left?
                      Most likely, IIRC they were there to deal with potential violence from Trump cultists who gathered after his whining "poor me" announcement.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

                        I reject the advocate of violence by both sides, but your being the overwhelming hypocrite justifying violence over actions taken by the Judges and the Justice Department including Trump appointees.
                        Where did I justify violence?

                        Atheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...

                        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post

                          Incorrect. He took them during his move out of the white house/last days IIRC. And they were not copies, they were original documents that the National Archive discovered were missing. As they'd have no way of knowing if Trump made copies, they'd then have no clue that he had them in order to ask for the missing documents. The defenses I'm seeing are getting more and more poorly thought through.
                          Considering that they haven't released the warrant or made any comment on what they went there to get, how are you suddenly an expert on what they went there for or if they were originals? And yes I am sure they make records of any copies made of classified documents.

                          Also I was commenting on the fact that other former presidents had classified documents in their possession, not specifically Trump.

                          Comment


                          • Apparently the FBI did not leave a copy of their warrant with the Trump estate, refused to allow Trump's personnel to observe, and did not leave a list of which items were confiscated, some of which were clearly not of national security concern, such as the letter Obama left for Trump as the former left office.
                            Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                            But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                            Than a fool in the eyes of God


                            From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Sparko View Post

                              Considering that they haven't released the warrant or made any comment on what they went there to get, how are you suddenly an expert on what they went there for or if they were originals? And yes I am sure they make records of any copies made of classified documents.

                              Also I was commenting on the fact that other former presidents had classified documents in their possession, not specifically Trump.
                              I'm not talking about what they were there for. I'm referring to the boxes of documents he had in his possession that the National Archives had to twist his arm to get back. Those were original documents that the archives knew were missing and did not have. And a number of them that they received back were classifies, and a number were damaged and torn up which could potentially be another violation of the law.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                                Apparently the FBI did not leave a copy of their warrant with the Trump estate, refused to allow Trump's personnel to observe, and did not leave a list of which items were confiscated, some of which were clearly not of national security concern, such as the letter Obama left for Trump as the former left office.
                                Source?


                                And why would they only be able to confiscate things that were of national security concern? Where are you getting this from? I heard some Senator bleat about "national security concern" this morning too so clearly that's some new talking point.
                                Last edited by Gondwanaland; 08-10-2022, 09:25 AM.

                                Comment

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