Back to the Office

[Thoughtful Monk]

Elon Musk has said all Tesla office workers must return to the office for 40 hours a week. His argument is it's what we expected of factory workers so why should you be different? Also, he seems to view remote working as people pretending to work. He says people at Tesla who don't return will be considered as having resigned. Link to one of many articles on the topic: https://www.cnn.com/2022/06/01/tech/...ome/index.html

I can see his point. I personally am on a 2-days in the office and 3-days home schedule right now. Not seeing any signs that's going to change anytime soon. My experience is many people at my work who are home seem to be putting in full days. I do have one candidate who seems to be only working part time on a full time position while 5-days at home. I will admit this could be just my impression.

What do you think? Is Musk on to something or out of touch with our new reality? I'm sort of mixed on this. I think there are a lot of people working hard at home but there are also slackers taking advantage of the lower visibility.

[Gondwanaland]

Elon Musk has said all Tesla office workers must return to the office for 40 hours a week. His argument is it's what we expected of factory workers so why should you be different? Also, he seems to view remote working as people pretending to work. He says people at Tesla who don't return will be considered as having resigned. Link to one of many articles on the topic: https://www.cnn.com/2022/06/01/tech/...ome/index.html

I can see his point. I personally am on a 2-days in the office and 3-days home schedule right now. Not seeing any signs that's going to change anytime soon. My experience is many people at my work who are home seem to be putting in full days. I do have one candidate who seems to be only working part time on a full time position while 5-days at home. I will admit this could be just my impression.

What do you think? Is Musk on to something or out of touch with our new reality? I'm sort of mixed on this. I think there are a lot of people working hard at home but there are also slackers taking advantage of the lower visibility.

I'm mixed as well. Certainly he has the right to do it, and he has a bit of a point with expecting factory workers to show up. There's also the issue of it being harder to train new people when most aren't in the office.

On the other hand, I've heard this claim by a number of CEOs that people working remotely are "pretending to work", etc..

That's not remotely been our experience at our smaller company. Indeed, we're getting more done, don't have to spend an hour plus on the road in traffic to and from work, and as a result have more time to spend with our families which improves morale which improves productivity and retention and lowers turnover (our turnover has dropped by almost 100%). Our CEO is so impressed we plan on letting anyone who prefers remote work to do so indefinitely.

[Thoughtful Monk]

I'm mixed as well. Certainly he has the right to do it, and he has a bit of a point with expecting factory workers to show up. There's also the issue of it being harder to train new people when most aren't in the office.

On the other hand, I've heard this claim by a number of CEOs that people working remotely are "pretending to work", etc..

That's not remotely been our experience at our smaller company. Indeed, we're getting more done, don't have to spend an hour plus on the road in traffic to and from work, and as a result have more time to spend with our families which improves morale which improves productivity and retention and lowers turnover (our turnover has dropped by almost 100%). Our CEO is so impressed we plan on letting anyone who prefers remote work to do so indefinitely.

I'm glad working remotely is working well at your company.

I did read an article that it's not being in the office people hate but the commute. I'm lucky - 10-minute commute.

[Mountain Man]

There is no reason people can't return to full time, in person work. In fact, there was never a reason in-person work should have been suspended in the first place.

[rogue06]

Elon Musk has said all Tesla office workers must return to the office for 40 hours a week. His argument is it's what we expected of factory workers so why should you be different? Also, he seems to view remote working as people pretending to work. He says people at Tesla who don't return will be considered as having resigned. Link to one of many articles on the topic: https://www.cnn.com/2022/06/01/tech/...ome/index.html

I can see his point. I personally am on a 2-days in the office and 3-days home schedule right now. Not seeing any signs that's going to change anytime soon. My experience is many people at my work who are home seem to be putting in full days. I do have one candidate who seems to be only working part time on a full time position while 5-days at home. I will admit this could be just my impression.

What do you think? Is Musk on to something or out of touch with our new reality? I'm sort of mixed on this. I think there are a lot of people working hard at home but there are also slackers taking advantage of the lower visibility.

It should be interesting when he takes ownership of Twitter since they've told their employees that they can work from home in perpetuity.

[Ronson]

With gasoline prices as high as they are, it doesn't make sense to me (of course, at Tesla, Elon wants them all to drive Teslas). But it seems like his decision was a bit grumpy, like an ultimatum.

I work from home nearly 100% of the time now, unless I am visiting a customer. Yeah, I can get a bit lazy at times. I don't mind working from an office so long as it is relatively nearby.

[Gondwanaland]

With gasoline prices as high as they are, it doesn't make sense to me (of course, at Tesla, Elon wants them all to drive Teslas). But it seems like his decision was a bit grumpy, like an ultimatum.

I work from home nearly 100% of the time now, unless I am visiting a customer. Yeah, I can get a bit lazy at times. I don't mind working from an office so long as it is relatively nearby.

Yeah I have been home working for the last week and haven't driven my car until today. Quite the surprise to see it jumped 40 cents in a week by me

[KingsGambit]

I can't imagine it's healthy to spend all your time at home without much human interaction. During the pandemic, my workplace offered to let me work from home several times; the vast majority of my office did, and I was one of the few who stayed in the office. It felt good having a sort of routine.

That was then. Now gas prices are the wild card, and if the work can be done more efficiently from home, it's hard to justify forcing an expensive commute. Perhaps jobs that involve heavy monitoring work better from home, as one can't get away with goofing off (a call center environment comes to mind).

[EvoUK]

I was thinking of starting a similar thread myself. There's various news papers here pushing for a full return of office workers to the workplace, whilst most businesses are completely fine with a more flexible schedule.

But that's the point really- flexibility. It's not about employers dictating that staff come in 1-5 days a week, it's more about staff and employers/line managers vary the amount of time staff come in depending on what's happening in the office.

I vary from remote working several weeks in a row to coming in almost every day during the week, depending on what is happening in the office. I have no intention of spending two hours a day commuting just to answer some emails or join a few video calls. But if something is happening where I need to be there, then no problem.

It also gives newer or younger staff the option of coming in more often. I was fortunate in that I recently got on the property ladder, but if I was still in my old circumstances at home I'd likely decide to be in the office more, which is the case for some of my colleagues.


Companies are finding it harder to find staff currently, and those who don't offer flexible working simply have less to offer potential employees. It's been going this way for a while now - too slowly due to resistance to change at the top across many sectors- but fortunately the pandemic managed to give the whole process a much needed kick in the tush, and prove that the fears of reduced productivity etc was baseless.

[rogue06]

I can't imagine it's healthy to spend all your time at home without much human interaction. During the pandemic, my workplace offered to let me work from home several times; the vast majority of my office did, and I was one of the few who stayed in the office. It felt good having a sort of routine.

That was then. Now gas prices are the wild card, and if the work can be done more efficiently from home, it's hard to justify forcing an expensive commute. Perhaps jobs that involve heavy monitoring work better from home, as one can't get away with goofing off (a call center environment comes to mind).

One of the big problems that is arising is with new hires. People that worked at a job awhile before the lockdowns pretty much new how things worked and what was expected. New hires, especially those entering the job market don't have that background and FWIU it really shows.

[Starlight]

The work from home flexibility seems to be mostly positive for most people. And what studies I've heard of, suggest most people on average end up doing more work when working from home.

But there definitely are drawbacks for some people. Some people had relied on their workplace for their social life, and are struggling socially now. Other people just don't actually do any work when at home. etc.

Elon Musk has said all Tesla office workers must return to the office for 40 hours a week. His argument is it's what we expected of factory workers so why should you be different?

The factory work just isn't a job that can be done remotely. Whereas the white collar jobs can. So his question of why should they be different has an obvious answer: Because they are different jobs, one of which can be done remotely and one which can't. Presumably the pay isn't identical between the jobs either, nor the skills or educational backgrounds required, nor numerous other things.

Also, he seems to view remote working as people pretending to work.

Given the amount of time Musk spends posting on twitter, that seems to be a full time job for him, and so it's easy to see where he gets this view of remote working from: He seems to do almost no work himself. He's shocked people recently with comments that he isn't even on the board of companies people thought he was running, and that the SpaceX board that he is on only meets twice a year. Easy to see why he's got so much time to tweet.

I personally am on a 2-days in the office and 3-days home schedule right now. Not seeing any signs that's going to change anytime soon. My experience is many people at my work who are home seem to be putting in full days

Ditto for me and the people in my office.

Is Musk on to something or out of touch with our new reality?

I think he's out of touch on this. Given all the investigations and lawsuits about really awful working conditions at Tesla, it's hardly surprising to see an email from Musk imposing additional working conditions as it sounds like it's par for the course. It's probably an attempt to help pump up Tesla's ridiculously overinflated stock price again, because that seems to be what Musk focuses on. I think also because he spends his time tweeting rather than working, he projects that onto others and assumes they're also not working when not in the office, but that's just because he's out of touch and hasn't bothered to pay attention to his employees.

[Ronson]

Yeah I have been home working for the last week and haven't driven my car until today. Quite the surprise to see it jumped 40 cents in a week by me

Because of gas prices, my wife's employer just decided to allow workers to work from home (if they want). We're in the process of setting up a home office for her, to start the week after next.

[rogue06]

The work from home flexibility seems to be mostly positive for most people. And what studies I've heard of, suggest most people on average end up doing more work when working from home.

But there definitely are drawbacks for some people. Some people had relied on their workplace for their social life, and are struggling socially now. Other people just don't actually do any work when at home. etc.

The factory work just isn't a job that can be done remotely. Whereas the white collar jobs can. So his question of why should they be different has an obvious answer: Because they are different jobs, one of which can be done remotely and one which can't. Presumably the pay isn't identical between the jobs either, nor the skills or educational backgrounds required, nor numerous other things.

Given the amount of time Musk spends posting on twitter, that seems to be a full time job for him, and so it's easy to see where he gets this view of remote working from: He seems to do almost no work himself. He's shocked people recently with comments that he isn't even on the board of companies people thought he was running, and that the SpaceX board that he is on only meets twice a year. Easy to see why he's got so much time to tweet.

Ditto for me and the people in my office.

I think he's out of touch on this. Given all the investigations and lawsuits about really awful working conditions at Tesla, it's hardly surprising to see an email from Musk imposing additional working conditions as it sounds like it's par for the course. It's probably an attempt to help pump up Tesla's ridiculously overinflated stock price again, because that seems to be what Musk focuses on. I think also because he spends his time tweeting rather than working, he projects that onto others and assumes they're also not working when not in the office, but that's just because he's out of touch and hasn't bothered to pay attention to his employees.

When the lockdowns started there were reports of how there was a slight uptick in productivity. But apparently it did not last. A recent study found that the more someone works from home the less productive they become -- particularly when it comes to team or group performance on projects.

This is why Goldman’s CEO David Solomon called working from home an "aberration that we’re going to correct as quickly as possible." And JPMorgan CEO Jamie Dimon said of exclusively remote work: "It doesn’t work for those who want to hustle. It doesn’t work for spontaneous idea generation. It doesn’t work for culture."

I think it really depends on the business and what sort of job is involved. Fields where teamwork is important would probably do better reestablishing the office environment

[rogue06]

Because of gas prices, my wife's employer just decided to allow workers to work from home (if they want). We're in the process of setting up a home office for her, to start the week after next.

With more than one industry expert predicting +$6/gallon gas this Summer (Let's Go Brandon!) I think that will act as a brake to the movement to return to the workplace.

[Ronson]

With more than one industry expert predicting +$6/gallon gas this Summer (Let's Go Brandon!) I think that will act as a brake to the movement to return to the workplace.

There's one encouraging possibility on the horizon. Traditionally, OPEC doesn't like to see the world economy get bogged down, so it tries to play a balancing act of high prices-but not too high. If too high, demand dries up, frackers make profits again, and the drive to alternate energy heats up.

So, I'm thinking that OPEC will agree to increase production to replace much of Russia oil.