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  • Hypatia_Alexandria
    replied
    Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
    More than likely from bandits since they would be commissioned to spread the Good News which required a good bit of traveling.
    At night? Just after dinner and shortly before Jesus' arrest?

    Leave a comment:


  • Mountain Man
    replied
    Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post

    Thank you for exposing the precise problem with his post that I was speaking about.
    Whatever you say, seminary dropout.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gondwanaland
    replied
    Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
    Then why did you refer to my comments about a Triune deity as "this crap"?

    You have alleged that you have some acquaintance with Latin and Greek.

    The Greek term Homoousios [same substance] translates into Latin as Consubstantia.

    That is the basis of the Triune deity - i.e. the Trinity.

    Your creed incorporates language from the Apostles Creed and the Nicene Creed.
    Actually it best translates as same essence, IIRC, but substance is an acceptable alternative.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gondwanaland
    replied
    Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

    If God is the first cause, then he is uncreated by definition. Asking who or what created the first cause is like asking what the color blue smells like. It's a nonsense question.
    Thank you for exposing the precise problem with his post that I was speaking about.

    Leave a comment:


  • Hypatia_Alexandria
    replied
    Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

    Now you simply doubling down on your ignorance --- I most certainly believe in a Triune God.
    Then why did you refer to my comments about a Triune deity as "this crap"?

    You have alleged that you have some acquaintance with Latin and Greek.

    The Greek term Homoousios [same substance] translates into Latin as Consubstantia.

    That is the basis of the Triune deity - i.e. the Trinity.

    Your creed incorporates language from the Apostles Creed and the Nicene Creed.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gondwanaland
    replied
    Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
    It's more that it's the sort of stuff expected from "Junior Atheists" rather than anyone who is serious.

    The whole can God make a rock that he can't lift is not very well thought out. George Carlin even cites it as the sorta question that the kids at his parochial school would come up with to try to stump the priest (IIRC his imitation of them asking makes it clear he, even though an atheist, was fairly contemptuous of them -- you generally don't make someone you agree with sound like an imbecile talking when you imitate them).

    A better question might be "could God limit His own ability to lift a heavy rock?" or maybe even "Is God capable of being incapable?" In his Summa Theologica Aquinas, while examining the question of whether God can make the past not to have been, argues that "there does not fall under the scope of God's omnipotence anything that implies a contradiction" which IMHBAO effectively means that any intrinsic contradiction or logical impossibility isn't a part of God's omnipotence. IOW, while inherent contradictions make for great rhetorical literary devices they aren't a valid question for theology.
    AN entire post dedicated to a strawman, how lovely.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gondwanaland
    replied
    Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

    Never said otherwise, and provided the cite that backs it up.
    You did say otherwise with your objection to her.


    Actually, the whole term "substance" was hotly debated.
    But the term in question is variably translated to substance/being/ etc. The debate she is talking about is one that took place about whether Jesus and the Father are the same being, same essence, etc.. WHich according to your link you believe. Which indicates to me you didn't know what she was talking about.

    I studied the creeds in Seminary, so I was quite up to speed on them.
    We don't do creeds, and avoid that whole "substance" thing, as it was even quite debated and disputed back then, as was consubstantiation and substantiation and other matters.
    But your own link itself states you believe he is the same being, which means you do accept it.

    But it's very noble of you to carry her water.
    Not carrying her water, snookums, just correcting your ignorance.

    Leave a comment:


  • Cow Poke
    replied
    Originally posted by CivilDiscourse View Post
    That's interesting, given how much she uses the "did I say that" argurment when someone infers her position from what she's written,
    Or how she goes from one failed position, then flies like a witch on a scramjet broom to the other extreme -- so you don't believe the TRINITY!




    Leave a comment:


  • Mountain Man
    replied
    Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post

    Well of course you so. Because you can't answer the question. People like you hate such questions because they call your deity strongly into doubt so you push back with nonsense like this.
    If God is the first cause, then he is uncreated by definition. Asking who or what created the first cause is like asking what the color blue smells like. It's a nonsense question.

    Leave a comment:


  • rogue06
    replied
    Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post

    Well of course you so. Because you can't answer the question. People like you hate such questions because they call your deity strongly into doubt so you push back with nonsense like this.
    It's more that it's the sort of stuff expected from "Junior Atheists" rather than anyone who is serious.

    The whole can God make a rock that he can't lift is not very well thought out. George Carlin even cites it as the sorta question that the kids at his parochial school would come up with to try to stump the priest (IIRC his imitation of them asking makes it clear he, even though an atheist, was fairly contemptuous of them -- you generally don't make someone you agree with sound like an imbecile talking when you imitate them).

    A better question might be "could God limit His own ability to lift a heavy rock?" or maybe even "Is God capable of being incapable?" In his Summa Theologica Aquinas, while examining the question of whether God can make the past not to have been, argues that "there does not fall under the scope of God's omnipotence anything that implies a contradiction" which IMHBAO effectively means that any intrinsic contradiction or logical impossibility isn't a part of God's omnipotence. IOW, while inherent contradictions make for great rhetorical literary devices they aren't a valid question for theology.

    Leave a comment:


  • Cow Poke
    replied
    Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post
    Oh? So you do believe he is one being with the father.
    Never said otherwise, and provided the cite that backs it up.

    So your objection doesn't really hold up, as the term Hypatia used means substance/being/essence, essentially. Which implies to me she was actually correct that you don't know what you're talking about wrt the Council.
    Actually, the whole term "substance" was hotly debated.

    I studied the creeds in Seminary, so I was quite up to speed on them.
    We don't do creeds, and avoid that whole "substance" thing, as it was even quite debated and disputed back then, as was consubstantiation and substantiation and other matters.

    But it's very noble of you to carry her water.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gondwanaland
    replied
    Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

    My prior response....



    Oh? So you do believe he is one being with the father. So your objection doesn't really hold up, as the term Hypatia used means substance/being/essence, essentially. Which implies to me she was actually correct that you don't know what you're talking about wrt the Council.

    That or you were just trolling her, which, fair enough.

    Leave a comment:


  • Cow Poke
    replied
    Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post

    Interesting, as a former WELS Christian we didn't really pay much attention to baptists other than that they didn't baptize babies. I didn't realize you guys don't believe that Jesus is one being with the Father....
    My prior response....

    Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

    Now you're simply doubling down on your ignorance --- I most certainly believe in a Triune God.

    Really - stop saying stupid stuff.

    Here's our Baptist Faith & Message, which describes what we believe.

    Find the word "substance" in there.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gondwanaland
    replied
    Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

    The "crap" is where you assign a position to a person ASSUMING you know what they believe - I don't care about your "differing" --- stop being such an arrogant ASSUMER!
    Interesting, as a former WELS Christian we didn't really pay much attention to baptists other than that they didn't baptize babies. I didn't realize you guys don't believe that Jesus is one being with the Father..... Or are you just some weird unitarian Baptist Sect?
    Last edited by Gondwanaland; 12-03-2021, 08:41 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Cow Poke
    replied
    Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
    See my response to MM at post #235.
    I think Jesus was also dealing with the fact that so many had assumed that He had come to set up His Kingdom on earth, and to overthrow the Roman government.

    Matthew 10:16
    “I am sending you out like sheep among wolves. Therefore be as shrewd as snakes and as innocent as doves.”

    "The World" was still "The World". It wasn't going to be a cakewalk.

    Leave a comment:

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