Pfizer Scientists Admit: "Your Antibodies Are Probably Better Than The Vaccination"

[Juvenal]

Sorry if I misinterpreted.

If Jim had been more clear, there wouldn't have been room for misinterpretation. So there are two lessons to be learned from this.

First, it's always Jaltus' fault.

And second, we really need to ban Trout.

Correct. And I think my case is pretty strong.

Or you wouldn't be making it.

The only things I've ever seen about the Kentucky study were complaints about the inadequate sample size.

Yes and no. The gross sample was all of Kentucky, but the inferences were being drawn from just the Kentuckians who had been reinfected after a prior infection, an unavoidably small number, but demonstrably greater than zero, as in ...

I was referring to the Cleveland Clinic study: "...during the study, none of the employees who had confirmed positive PCR tests and remained unvaccinated were re-infected."

I'm assuming my google fu has found the right study.

It's still in preprint, and from June, meaning it's going to be missing the same fourth-wave delta infections missing from the Kentucky study. The gross sample size is a tiny fraction of the Kentucky study, 4.5 million v. 0.05 million, or 85 to 1.

Looking more closely ...
.

In a Cox proportional hazards regression model, after adjusting for the phase of the epidemic, vaccination was associated with a significantly lower risk of SARS-CoV-2 infection among those not previously infected (HR 0.031, 95% CI 0.015 to 0.061) but not among those previously infected (HR 0.313, 95% CI 0 to Infinity).

Oh. My. God. Those. Confidence. Intervals.

Especially for the previously infected, "95% CI 0 to Infinity"

The preprint is from June, and considering that it's not mathematically possible to find results more useless than that, call me crazy, but I'm gonna go out on a limb and say this will never be published.

Well, it doesn't seem to be working long term, and boosters are now becoming evident.

Point.

To what end? I know the concern about vaccines developed using aborted fetal remains, but have been assured that 2 of the 3 big ones don't use them directly.

Tested using aborted fetal remains, not developed. And I have a great deal of sympathy for folks who feel strongly about abortion, and don't wish to be complicit.

It still amazes me that anyone would jump out of a perfectly good airplane...

If you can't jump out of it, I wouldn't even call it good. True story, after a summer of skydiving almost daily, I needed to take a business flight and found myself inexplicably in a high state of tension as I was boarding. Something was wrong.

Something was VERY WRONG.

I figured it out.

I wasn't wearing a parachute.

Emergency rooms aren't being closed. Some have been overwhelmed temporarily by localized outbreaks that they weren't equipped to handle, but emergency rooms aren't closing.

Localized outbreaks all but entirely made up of the unvaccinated.

Full disclosure - My wife's cousin died of COVID 3 months after being vaccinated. That was the last straw for me. I also have heart disease in my family medical history. I simply see no need in taking even a small risk if I don't need to.

First of all, condolences, of course, but are you suggesting she died because of the vaccination?

Is it wrong that I laughed that hard? Thanks for the incentive!

It's not wrong, it's VERY WRONG.

And H_A says I'm wrong to develop positive relationships with y'all.

Forcing people to decide between their bodily autonomy and their livelihood is pretty tyrannical. It may not rise to the level of what you've witnessed, but tiny tyrants are still tyrants. See HOA boards for example.

There's a reason I chose undeveloped land in an unincorporated area.

[Mountain Man]

The Pfizer one is too.

Did you know that the former head of the FDA is on Pfizer's board of directors? That could explain how they were able to get approval fast-tracked, easily clearing numerous hurdles that have so far stymied Mordena and Johnson & Johnson.

[Sparko]

Because they don't own me like they did when I was in. When I enlisted, vaccinations were part of the agreement to enlist. This vaccine was not a condition of employment with my agency 2 years ago when I was hired. I refuse to take this unnecessary risk. My immune system is working properly and I don't need the vaccine.

Did you know that when the polio vaccine came out, it was not recommended for anyone who had recovered from polio? Same with the chicken pox vaccine, which I have never received, even during my enlistment.

My brother and his wife had covid and still got the shots. No adverse effects other than a sore arm.

[oxmixmudd]

Interesting you should use the phrase "mainstream scientist". Is that the qualification these days? If a scientist is "mainstream", he/she is credible, but if not, then no?

And who makes them "mainstream"?

I use it because there are so many charlatans out there. There could be a better term I suppose. Legitimate scientists doing legitimate research in real labs. Not fellows making videos for profit selling their wares on the internet or giving seminars to political special interests as the primary means of income. Not people funded by anti global warming groups, or political pacs. There are a lot of ways to try to define it, but mainstream is a fairly decent filter for the whackos, though not perfect.

The outliers tend to be outliers CP. The fact sometimes they are on to something is substantially overrated when it comes to arbitrarily rejecting what doesn't happen to make sense to us or what conflicts with what we believe or have been taught.

[Juvenal]

For me, it's not that....

It's more like things such as -- if the government were REALLY serious about mandatory vaccinations, why aren't they at our southern border en masse?

Ya should have checked that before you posted it the first time. Like I did, just afterwards, and then sighed.

Cause clean-up on aisle CP ain't my job.

[NorrinRadd]

I haven't heard any Fox News personality suggest you shouldn't get the vaccine or that the vaccines are not effective. They and the experts they put on all say to get the shots. The only thing 'negative' they talk about is vaccine mandates. They are against them.

Laura Ingraham and to a lesser extent Tucker Carlson have had, and continue to have, guests who question the *extent* to which the jabs are safe and effective, but I have never heard either host recommend against the jabs. I have also never heard them disclose their own vax statuses, but both are fully anti-mandate. Hannity and Dan Bongino are both firmly anti-mandate, but both affirm they themselves are vaxed.

[Sparko]

Laura Ingraham and to a lesser extent Tucker Carlson have had, and continue to have, guests who question the *extent* to which the jabs are safe and effective, but I have never heard either host recommend against the jabs. I have also never heard them disclose their own vax statuses, but both are fully anti-mandate. Hannity and Dan Bongino are both firmly anti-mandate, but both affirm they themselves are vaxed.

I was thinking of those two doctors they usually put on to talk about COVID. One is an older guy, balding with glasses, and the second is a woman doctor. Both constantly advocate getting vaccinated.

Marc Siegel and Nicole Saphier

[seanD]

First we had the "Pfizer is evil" confirmation, now we have this... covid cult ain't gonna like this one either....

Covid-19: Researcher blows the whistle on data integrity issues in Pfizer’s vaccine trial

In autumn 2020 Pfizer’s chairman and chief executive, Albert Bourla, released an open letter to the billions of people around the world who were investing their hopes in a safe and effective covid-19 vaccine to end the pandemic. “As I’ve said before, we are operating at the speed of science,” Bourla wrote, explaining to the public when they could expect a Pfizer vaccine to be authorised in the United States.1

But, for researchers who were testing Pfizer’s vaccine at several sites in Texas during that autumn, speed may have come at the cost of data integrity and patient safety. A regional director who was employed at the research organisation Ventavia Research Group has told The BMJ that the company falsified data, unblinded patients, employed inadequately trained vaccinators, and was slow to follow up on adverse events reported in Pfizer’s pivotal phase III trial. Staff who conducted quality control checks were overwhelmed by the volume of problems they were finding. After repeatedly notifying Ventavia of these problems, the regional director, Brook Jackson, emailed a complaint to the US Food and Drug Administration (FDA). Ventavia fired her later the same day. Jackson has provided The BMJ with dozens of internal company documents, photos, audio recordings, and emails.

Poor laboratory management

On its website Ventavia calls itself the largest privately owned clinical research company in Texas and lists many awards it has won for its contract work.2 But Jackson has told The BMJ that, during the two weeks she was employed at Ventavia in September 2020, she repeatedly informed her superiors of poor laboratory management, patient safety concerns, and data integrity issues. Jackson was a trained clinical trial auditor who previously held a director of operations position and came to Ventavia with more than 15 years’ experience in clinical research coordination and management. Exasperated that Ventavia was not dealing with the problems, Jackson documented several matters late one night, taking photos on her mobile phone. One photo, provided to The BMJ, showed needles discarded in a plastic biohazard bag instead of a sharps container box. Another showed vaccine packaging materials with trial participants’ identification numbers written on them left out in the open, potentially unblinding participants. Ventavia executives later questioned Jackson for taking the photos.

Early and inadvertent unblinding may have occurred on a far wider scale. According to the trial’s design, unblinded staff were responsible for preparing and administering the study drug (Pfizer’s vaccine or a placebo). This was to be done to preserve the blinding of trial participants and all other site staff, including the principal investigator. However, at Ventavia, Jackson told The BMJ that drug assignment confirmation printouts were being left in participants’ charts, accessible to blinded personnel. As a corrective action taken in September, two months into trial recruitment and with around 1000 participants already enrolled, quality assurance checklists were updated with instructions for staff to remove drug assignments from charts.

In a recording of a meeting in late September2020 between Jackson and two directors a Ventavia executive can be heard explaining that the company wasn’t able to quantify the types and number of errors they were finding when examining the trial paperwork for quality control. “In my mind, it’s something new every day,” a Ventavia executive says. “We know that it’s significant.”

Ventavia was not keeping up with data entry queries, shows an email sent by ICON, the contract research organisation with which Pfizer partnered on the trial. ICON reminded Ventavia in a September 2020 email: “The expectation for this study is that all queries are addressed within 24hrs.” ICON then highlighted over 100 outstanding queries older than three days in yellow. Examples included two individuals for which “Subject has reported with Severe symptoms/reactions … Per protocol, subjects experiencing Grade 3 local reactions should be contacted. Please confirm if an UNPLANNED CONTACT was made and update the corresponding form as appropriate.” According to the trial protocol a telephone contact should have occurred “to ascertain further details and determine whether a site visit is clinically indicated.”

[Starlight]

Obviously it's not great if there were bad things happening with Pfizer, but that doesn't change the empirical data from millions of people that countries around the world have subsequently collected about how well the vaccines work.

[seanD]

Obviously it's not great if there were bad things happening with Pfizer, but that doesn't change the empirical data from millions of people that countries around the world have subsequently collected about how well the vaccines work.

This type of behavior from big pharma shouldn't at all be a shock to us. This is what big pharma does. What's surprising is how leftists have become shills for big pharma. Cults do crazy things to people.

[Mountain Man]

Obviously it's not great if there were bad things happening with Pfizer, but that doesn't change the empirical data from millions of people that countries around the world have subsequently collected about how well the vaccines work.

Sure, especially when you ignore all the empirical data subsequently collected about how dangerous and ineffective they are.

[seanD]

Sure, especially when you ignore all the empirical data subsequently collected about how dangerous and ineffective they are.

I wonder what the next revelation is going to be. They seem to be getting bigger with each revelation. Maybe that jab side effects data is skewed and even worse than is being reported.

[Cow Poke]

I wonder what the next revelation is going to be. They seem to be getting bigger with each revelation. Maybe that jab side effects data is skewed and even worse than is being reported.

For people who claim "always trust the science", they sure are sloppy with their "science".

[seanD]

For people who claim "always trust the science", they sure are sloppy with their "science".

If there ever was a silver lining to all this in the last +year is how much I've learned about the scientific process, how tightly-knit the community is against criticism and opposition, and how corrupt and untrustworthy it is. It's been eye-opening for me personally and has firmly solidified some of my previous theological beliefs.

[Starlight]

As a scientist myself, this pandemic has taught me that most of the general public are really stupid and have no understanding of science, and that conspiracy nuts like you guys will use any excuse to seize on inaccurate interpretations of scientific papers and find every unreasonable reason you can to discredit science and facts and believe whatever crazy nuttery you felt like believing. In general it's convinced me many people are beyond the pale and there's no reaching them by evidence, argument, or rationality... the nutters believe whatever it is they feel like and for them everything is a conspiracy and their feelings are their only guide to truth.