Manchin: Why I Won’t Support Spending Another $3.5 Trillion

[Cow Poke]

Why I Won’t Support Spending Another $3.5 Trillion

The nation faces an unprecedented array of challenges and will inevitably encounter additional crises in the future. Yet some in Congress have a strange belief there is an infinite supply of money to deal with any current or future crisis, and that spending trillions upon trillions will have no negative consequence for the future. I disagree.

An overheating economy has imposed a costly “inflation tax” on every middle- and working-class American. At $28.7 trillion and growing, the nation’s debt has reached record levels. Over the past 18 months, we’ve spent more than $5 trillion responding to the coronavirus pandemic. Now Democratic congressional leaders propose to pass the largest single spending bill in history with no regard to rising inflation, crippling debt or the inevitability of future crises. Ignoring the fiscal consequences of our policy choices will create a disastrous future for the next generation of Americans.

Long story short, Manchin is doubling down on NOT supporting the bit Drunken Sailor Give-Away Program of the Liberals.

Some say he's doing this so the Liberals will have to kiss his 6 to move forward.
Some say he's just trying to cement his place in West Virginia where his State voted overwhelmingly for Trump.
Some say he's signaling he is considering jumping ship to the Republican party.

What say you?

[seanD]

Maybe he understands economics, and knows that all this insane amount of money is going to be created by a central bank, and thus make the inflation we're seeing now (and what's going to come) nightmarishly worse.

[Cow Poke]

Maybe he understands economics, and knows that all this insane amount of money is going to be created by a central bank, and thus make the inflation we're seeing now (and what's going to come) nightmarishly worse. Of course, I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt here and assuming he understands this, which is a tall order.

I'm a cynic when it comes to politicians, but I wouldn't be too terribly shocked if he was "for real", and it was as you said.

[seanD]

I'm a cynic when it comes to politicians, but I wouldn't be too terribly shocked if he was "for real", and it was as you said.

It is strange, being that it seems a spell has come over our lawmakers, including both parities. How he broke the spell is an enigma.

[Starlight]

Because Manchin is shockingly, stunningly, corrupt, to the point where its sickening.

This is just more of that.

Manchin.JPG
It's primarily because the Dems are proposing raising some taxes on the ultra-rich to pay for some of the things. That's intolerable to the people who own 10 mansions. So because they own Manchin too, they've got him out there barking at it like their good little dog.

Meanwhile their paid propaganda outlets are busy trying to trick the populace into thinking spending on things to help the populace is bad. Meanwhile the over bloated military spending got yet another massive increase on the side as a bone thrown to the defense contractors as an apology for ending on of their forever-wars, and nobody except principled progressives blinked an eye at it. The ultrarich are fine with it if the big spending is coming their way rather than going to the people.

[Cow Poke]

Because Manchin is shockingly, stunningly, corrupt, to the point where its sickening.

This is just more of that.

Manchin.JPG
It's primarily because the Dems are proposing raising some taxes on the ultra-rich to pay for some of the things. That's intolerable to the people who own 10 mansions. So because they own Manchin too, they've got him out there barking at it like their good little dog.

Meanwhile their paid propaganda outlets are busy trying to trick the populace into thinking spending on things to help the populace is bad. Meanwhile the over bloated military spending got yet another massive increase on the side as a bone thrown to the defense contractors as an apology for ending on of their forever-wars, and nobody except principled progressives blinked an eye at it. The ultrarich are fine with it if the big spending is coming their way rather than going to the people.

If you post in this thread again, can you please be less over the top shrill?

Thanks

[seanD]

Because Manchin is shockingly, stunningly, corrupt, to the point where its sickening.

This is just more of that.

Manchin.JPG
It's primarily because the Dems are proposing raising some taxes on the ultra-rich to pay for some of the things. That's intolerable to the people who own 10 mansions. So because they own Manchin too, they've got him out there barking at it like their good little dog.

Meanwhile their paid propaganda outlets are busy trying to trick the populace into thinking spending on things to help the populace is bad (meanwhile the over bloated military spending got yet another massive increase on the side as a bone thrown to the defense contractors as an apology for ending on of their forever-wars, and nobody except principled progressives blinked an eye at it. The ultrarich are fine with it if the big spending is coming their way rather than going to the people.).

The rise in inflation is a "trick" says Starlight.

As far as defense increase, yep, that's a travesty, but most Dems voted for it, just like most Dems voted for it under Trump. It's what they do.

[seer]

What say you?

Good on him!

[CivilDiscourse]

Because Manchin is shockingly, stunningly, corrupt, to the point where its sickening.

This is just more of that.

Manchin.JPG
It's primarily because the Dems are proposing raising some taxes on the ultra-rich to pay for some of the things. That's intolerable to the people who own 10 mansions. So because they own Manchin too, they've got him out there barking at it like their good little dog.

Meanwhile their paid propaganda outlets are busy trying to trick the populace into thinking spending on things to help the populace is bad. Meanwhile the over bloated military spending got yet another massive increase on the side as a bone thrown to the defense contractors as an apology for ending on of their forever-wars, and nobody except principled progressives blinked an eye at it. The ultrarich are fine with it if the big spending is coming their way rather than going to the people.

So, conspiracy theories are your reply...?

[rogue06]

The rise in inflation is a "trick" says Starlight.

As far as defense increase, yep, that's a travesty, but most Dems voted for it, just like most Dems voted for it under Trump. It's what they do.

Pretty much until the middle of last month many on the left were claiming inflation was just a momentary blip and minimal. Then it was determined that it is likely we're just at the start of an inflationary cycle with the worst rates in over 30 years.

star's TYT videos were probably still touting the "what inflation?" talking points (remember Biden bragging that hotdog prices were down by 16 cents on Independence Day?) that the rest of the left quietly tucked away.

[Mountain Man]

Meanwhile their paid propaganda outlets are busy trying to trick the populace into thinking spending on things to help the populace is bad.

It's not that anybody is against the government using its resources to actually improve the lives of citizens, at least in theory. The problem is that what the government chooses to spend its resources on is often of questionable value, and the price tag only gets bigger as time goes on.

But the even bigger problem that the government doesn't actually have the resources to spend and is planning to conjoure dollars out of thin air. The economic fallout will hardly be offset by whatever theoretical good their proposed social programs will bring. Yes, they pay lip service to "taxing the ultra-rich", but consider: 1) many politicians fall into the "ultra-rich" category themselves and will never agree to raising taxes to the punitive levels necessary to pay for their lavish social programs; 2) part of the reason the "ultra-rich" are ultra-rich is because they are very good at preventing other people, including governments, from taking their money; and 3) even if the government could somehow squeeze money out of the "ultra-rich", it will be nowhere near enough to offset the proposed spending.

[rogue06]

It's not that anybody is against the government using its resources to actually improve the lives of citizens, at least in theory. The problem is that what the government chooses to spend its resources on is often of questionable value, and the price tag only gets bigger as time goes on.

But the even bigger problem that the government doesn't actually have the resources to spend and is planning to conjoure dollars out of thin air. The economic fallout will hardly be offset by whatever theoretical good their proposed social programs will bring. Yes, they pay lip service to "taxing the ultra-rich", but consider: 1) many politicians fall into the "ultra-rich" category themselves and will never agree to raising taxes to the punitive levels necessary to pay for their lavish social programs; 2) part of the reason the "ultra-rich" are ultra-rich is because they are very good at preventing other people, including governments, from taking their money; and 3) even if the government could somehow squeeze money out of the "ultra-rich", it will be nowhere near enough to offset the proposed spending.

Even if they seized every single dime from the top 1% it would only pay a fraction of what they want to spend. So they keep redefining "rich" on down to include ever larger swaths of the Middle Class.

[Cow Poke]

Even if they seized every single dime from the top 1% it would only pay a fraction of what they want to spend. So they keep redefining "rich" on down to include ever larger swaths of the Middle Class.

AND.... what liberals could never be smart enough to figure out, these corporations have accountants and lawyers who can shift money around, or take production offshore, or just shut down factories completely.

Liberals are so STUPID that they think "We'll just tax the pants off that rich guy, and he'll just stand there and take it".

Liberals seem to play checkers while the rich have chess masters.

[Starlight]

Even if they seized every single dime from the top 1% it would only pay a fraction of what they want to spend. So they keep redefining "rich" on down to include ever larger swaths of the Middle Class.

Before you post, try googling the basic factual claims you're writing. It would reduce your number of falsehoods.

A quick google tells me that the wealth of the top 1% in the US is $41.52 trillion according to Federal Reserve data. Now I know you're hard of thinking, but $41.52 trillion is a larger number than either of the $3.5 trillion that is the topic of this thread, or of the $1 trillion infrastructure bill, or both combined, by near a factor of 10x. So you're not just wrong, you're way, way, way wrong.

[Starlight]

AND.... what liberals could never be smart enough to figure out, these corporations have accountants and lawyers who can shift money around, or take production offshore, or just shut down factories completely.

Liberals are so STUPID that they think "We'll just tax the pants off that rich guy, and he'll just stand there and take it".

Liberals seem to play checkers while the rich have chess masters.

Unfortunately conservatives are too stupid to understand that empowering the IRS to stop the rich hiding their money actually works. One analysis found that every extra dollar spent by the IRS on enforcement was netting the government $12 of additional tax that would have otherwise gone unpaid. So that seems a pretty good thing to pour more money into, right? Nail those tax cheats, which everyone else in the country who is themselves dutifully paying their taxes should be glad of, and create massive income for the government simultaneously.

And so what did Republicans do? Reduced funding to the IRS's enforcement, in order to allow the party's rich donors to hide their money and not pay tax like the rest of the country has to. It's almost comic book villainy.