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Has Biden Bungled Afghanistan?

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  • #46
    Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post
    We're still in Germany and Okinawa... j/s
    They don't have large, and violent, segments of the population that want us out.

    Comment


    • #47
      Originally posted by Stoic View Post

      They don't have large, and violent, segments of the population that want us out.
      They did. For many years after the fall of the Third Reich.
      That's what
      - She

      Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
      - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

      I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
      - Stephen R. Donaldson

      Comment


      • #48
        Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post

        They did. For many years after the fall of the Third Reich.
        Got any evidence for that?

        Source: https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2003/08/condi-rice-s-phony-history.html


        According to America’s Role in Nation-Building: From Germany to Iraq,a new study by former Ambassador James Dobbins, who had a lead role in the Somalia, Haiti, Bosnia, and Kosovo reconstruction efforts, and a team of RAND Corporation researchers, the total number of post-conflict American combat casualties in Germany—and Japan, Haiti, and the two Balkan cases—was zero.

        © Copyright Original Source

        Comment


        • #49
          Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post

          Pulling out while the enemy still has overwhelming forces against those we were there to protect is a recipe for disaster, which we are seeing play out in real time. It's beyond just "painful"
          We didn't go in there to "protect" anyone, nor should that be our mission since. The point was to get OBL. The guy has been dead for 10 years now. So based on that reason alone, we are 10 years overdue for a pullout.

          Comment


          • #50
            Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post

            Pulling out while the enemy still has overwhelming forces against those we were there to protect is a recipe for disaster, which we are seeing play out in real time. It's beyond just "painful"
            They're only the enemy because we've positioned them as such. A few decades ago we were arming and training them against the Soviets.

            They want us out, and there's no reason we should have been there in the first place. Just flipping leave already.

            Comment


            • #51
              Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
              To start, and something I've said in the past, you don't announce a freaking timetable. And when things aren't going as planned you don't announce that you're sticking to that time table come hell or high water.
              Thats nonsense. A timetable is needed and needs to be made clear, for the soldiers, our allies, and the people of this nation. Otherwise you get what we've seen for two bloody decades now: bleating about withdrawal and no follow through.

              Comment


              • #52
                Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                If you're familiar with folks in the military, that is pretty much the very last thing they would want.
                I served in the military. As has my son. That's exactly what some of these generals want. They're closely and incestuous linked with the Military Industrial Complex. Forever-War suits their interests.

                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post

                  They're only the enemy because we've positioned them as such.
                  Balderdash. We're their enemy because we're not Muslim.
                  A few decades ago we were arming and training them against the Soviets.
                  They were quite happy to receive aid from infidels to fight other infidels. We handled that rather poorly; there were other groups, who weren't radical Muslims, fighting the Soviets as well, but we routed our aid through Pakistan, which was only interested in helping the radicals.
                  Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

                  Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
                  sigpic
                  I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Originally posted by One Bad Pig View Post
                    Balderdash. We're their enemy because we're not Muslim.
                    no, we're their enemy because we chose to be in order to fight this Forever War.

                    They were quite happy to receive aid from infidels to fight other infidels. We handled that rather poorly; there were other groups, who weren't radical Muslims, fighting the Soviets as well, but we routed our aid through Pakistan, which was only interested in helping the radicals.
                    And we were quite happy to give them that aid and ally ourselves with them.

                    It's beyond time to leave, dude.

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Originally posted by Ronson View Post

                      We didn't go in there to "protect" anyone, nor should that be our mission since. The point was to get OBL. The guy has been dead for 10 years now. So based on that reason alone, we are 10 years overdue for a pullout.
                      It was about OBL AND those who supported and enabled him - the Taliban. Once we defeated the Taliban and ceded control to the Afghan government, our job was to help protect the people of Afghanistan from the Taliban's resurgence. We did that for 10 years. We quit that mission and now are seeing the fallacy of quitting - the same as quitting Vietnam. All we did by withdrawing is create thousands more dependent refugees for Europe and the US. We failed the people of Afghanistan by being quitters.
                      That's what
                      - She

                      Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
                      - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

                      I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
                      - Stephen R. Donaldson

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post

                        I served in the military. As has my son. That's exactly what some of these generals want. They're closely and incestuous linked with the Military Industrial Complex. Forever-War suits their interests.
                        I served too. I was in Diego Garcia while we were bombing the Taliban. Those bastards literally got a bomb with my name on it dropped on their head. All we have done by splitting in the middle of the night is create a huge sucking sound welcoming the Taliban to terrorize the people of that country...
                        That's what
                        - She

                        Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
                        - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

                        I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
                        - Stephen R. Donaldson

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Stoic View Post
                          Got any evidence for that?

                          Source: https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2003/08/condi-rice-s-phony-history.html


                          According to America’s Role in Nation-Building: From Germany to Iraq,a new study by former Ambassador James Dobbins, who had a lead role in the Somalia, Haiti, Bosnia, and Kosovo reconstruction efforts, and a team of RAND Corporation researchers, the total number of post-conflict American combat casualties in Germany—and Japan, Haiti, and the two Balkan cases—was zero.

                          © Copyright Original Source

                          My ex-wife served at Kelly Barracks in Germany. There were huge barricades all around the compound for a reason. Terrorism was a real thing there.
                          That's what
                          - She

                          Without a clear-cut definition of sin, morality becomes a mere argument over the best way to train animals
                          - Manya the Holy Szin (The Quintara Marathon)

                          I may not be as old as dirt, but me and dirt are starting to have an awful lot in common
                          - Stephen R. Donaldson

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post

                            I served too. I was in Diego Garcia while we were bombing the Taliban. Those bastards literally got a bomb with my name on it dropped on their head. All we have done by splitting in the middle of the night is create a huge sucking sound welcoming the Taliban to terrorize the people of that country...
                            We already terrorized the people of that country ourselves, and have killed many innocents there and poisoned the land. We've failed for two decades to get them to put any sort of effective government into place. They seem to want the Taliban. Let them have it. It's not our place or business to be there. I saw firsthand what Forever War does to the locals and to our troops when I served in Vietnam. Afghanistan and Iraq were just continuations of the same bloodthirsty ideals.

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Originally posted by Bill the Cat View Post

                              It was about OBL AND those who supported and enabled him - the Taliban. Once we defeated the Taliban and ceded control to the Afghan government, our job was to help protect the people of Afghanistan from the Taliban's resurgence. We did that for 10 years. We quit that mission and now are seeing the fallacy of quitting - the same as quitting Vietnam. All we did by withdrawing is create thousands more dependent refugees for Europe and the US. We failed the people of Afghanistan by being quitters.
                              No, we failed them by even going in in the first place. We failed them with the countless civilians we killed in this Forever War. We failed them when we poisoned their land.

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post
                                no, we're their enemy because we chose to be in order to fight this Forever War.
                                You can believe what you want, but it doesn't change the fact that they attacked us first. We're their enemy because we're not Muslim, and we're perceived as the leaders of the non-Muslim world.
                                Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom

                                Veritas vos Liberabit<>< Learn Greek <>< Look here for an Orthodox Church in America<><Ancient Faith Radio
                                sigpic
                                I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist

                                Comment

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