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The Blue Wall of Silence Is Starting to Crack

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  • The Blue Wall of Silence Is Starting to Crack

    An interesting op-ed piece from The New York Times on Friday 16 April on the officers that gave evidence against Derek Chauvin

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/16/o...it_nn_20210421


    Cops protect the state. They also are the state. We revere them for the first part. We fear them for the second. But even as we condemn another round of horrific and excessive state violence directed at Black Americans, there’s actually a ray of hope on the police reform blotter.

    The blue wall may be starting to crack. It was broken in the Derek Chauvin trial.

    It’s no small thing that several Minneapolis police officers, including Chief Medaria Arradondo, took the stand against Mr. Chauvin in his trial over the death of George Floyd. Fourteen officers in the same department signed an open letter last year saying Mr. Chauvin “failed as a human and stripped George Floyd of his dignity and life.”

    Maybe these acts of courage are isolated — mere dents in a wall that is institutional and pervasive. It will take far more than a few cops in a nation-shattering case of racist murder-by-authority to do structural damage to that edifice.

    Cops protecting bad cops is ingrained in the system. Many officers feel that only a brother or sister in blue knows the peril they face — and has their backs. That’s true to an extent. But people in far more dangerous lines of work certainly don’t share this attitude. Too many police officers act as if being the face of the law makes them above the law.

    Smashing the blue wall is one thing that has to happen to fix the lethal flaws in modern law enforcement. Another will be just as hard, if not more so: acknowledging that racism, like the code of silence, runs deep in police ranks.

    Defunding the police is not the answer. It’s an absurd idea. A wave of violence and chaos quickly overwhelmed an area declared police-free in Seattle, where I live, last summer. Among the victims were several people of color. “Two African-American men are dead,” said the city’s police chief at the time, Carmen Best, “at a place where they claim to be working for Black Lives Matter.”

    “Defund the police” is even worse as a political slogan; the idea is supported by only 18 percent of Americans, according to one poll from last month. Politically, all the slogan will do is hurt the cause of reform, as it appeared to drag down Democrats in last year’s congressional elections.

    Reinventing the police, a far better idea, got a start in New Orleans in 2016, with a program that teaches officers to intervene when they see fellow officers doing something bad. It’s about to get another go in Maryland, now that lawmakers just overrode a veto and passed sweeping police reform legislation.

    We need every cop to wear a body camera. We need to curb the power of police unions, the biggest protectors of the blue wall. And we need officers of all stripes to back the words of those 14 in Minneapolis. They said, “This is not who we are.” Now prove it.


    This protection of fellow [corrupt] officers is not unique to the USA of course. Anyone who has access to Netflix may have seen a British series entitled Line of Duty about an anti-corruption section within a regional police force in Britain investigating "bent coppers". Germany also has endemic racism within sections of the police along with the infiltration of the extreme Right.

    It is the age old problem of power which can, and often does lead to corruption, as well as that perennial question Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

    "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" Attrib. Seneca 4 BCE - 65 CE

  • #2
    I think the fact is that the George Floyd situation was so OBVIOUSLY wrong, that no honest cop can defend it at all.

    The next step should be "DEFUND POLICE UNIONS!" (at least, the ones who very aggressively protect bad cops)
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
      I think the fact is that the George Floyd situation was so OBVIOUSLY wrong, that no honest cop can defend it at all.

      The next step should be "DEFUND POLICE UNIONS!" (at least, the ones who very aggressively protect bad cops)
      Interesting... I skimmed the article, thinking I knew what it was saying, but in rereading it, some EGGcellent points are made...

      Defunding the police is not the answer. It’s an absurd idea. A wave of violence and chaos quickly overwhelmed an area declared police-free in Seattle, where I live, last summer. Among the victims were several people of color. “Two African-American men are dead,” said the city’s police chief at the time, Carmen Best, “at a place where they claim to be working for Black Lives Matter.”

      “Defund the police” is even worse as a political slogan; the idea is supported by only 18 percent of Americans, according to one poll from last month. Politically, all the slogan will do is hurt the cause of reform, as it appeared to drag down Democrats in last year’s congressional elections.


      I'm glad to see somebody actually expose this lunacy for what it is!

      Reinventing the police, a far better idea, got a start in New Orleans in 2016, with a program that teaches officers to intervene when they see fellow officers doing something bad. It’s about to get another go in Maryland, now that lawmakers just overrode a veto and passed sweeping police reform legislation.


      No problem with that whatsoever!

      We need every cop to wear a body camera.


      I used to be against this as it seemed to be "spying on cops" --- but in this crazy world, they can actually protect GOOD cops by showing they did what was right! I'm very much in favor of this.

      We need to curb the power of police unions, the biggest protectors of the blue wall.


      Amen!!! I have been saying that for YEARS!

      And we need officers of all stripes to back the words of those 14 in Minneapolis. They said, “This is not who we are.”


      I think this underplays the thousands of good cops who work to weed out the bad ones all the time -- they just don't make the news.

      Now prove it.


      Many already have been.
      "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
        ork to weed out the bad ones all the time -- they just don't make the news.

        Now prove it.


        Many already have been.
        Will it be enough though? I think that is the underlying premise of the article. How do ordinary police officers fight corruption and/or racism?

        Or do we send for Bud White and Ed Exley?
        "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" Attrib. Seneca 4 BCE - 65 CE

        Comment


        • #5
          Real life isn't a TV show. You seem to get too much of your information about police from movies and TV shows.

          No good police officer wants corrupt officers on the force. They never did.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
            Will it be enough though? I think that is the underlying premise of the article. How do ordinary police officers fight corruption and/or racism?
            Read the freakin' article!!!! Defund Police is NOT the answer --- getting rid of corrupt police unions.

            Or do we send for Bud White and Ed Exley?
            Is this a joke to you?

            "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

            Comment


            • #7
              The interesting thing is that cops are being held to a polar opposite standard to what is expected of the public.

              Good Cops are expected to testify against bad cops, to inform on them, i.e. If you see something, say something.

              On the other hand, the public such actions are considered "snitches", and the phrase goes "Snitches get stitches." Telling on someone doing something bad is considered something that should be punished.

              The thing is, all cops come from the public, and have had that standard ingrained into them.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by CivilDiscourse View Post
                The interesting thing is that cops are being held to a polar opposite standard to what is expected of the public.

                Good Cops are expected to testify against bad cops, to inform on them, i.e. If you see something, say something.

                On the other hand, the public such actions are considered "snitches", and the phrase goes "Snitches get stitches." Telling on someone doing something bad is considered something that should be punished.

                The thing is, all cops come from the public, and have had that standard ingrained into them.
                And that's a real problem. But it's complicated by the fact that a police officer who is even PERCEIVED as having snitched may be set up in a fatal situation where he needs assistance - like in a shoot-out or a mob situation - and the other officers "slow roll", or fail to respond at all.
                "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

                  Read the freakin' article!!!! Defund Police is NOT the answer
                  Yes I also read the article.

                  Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                  -- getting rid of corrupt police unions.
                  How will that benefit confronting institutionalised racism and/or corruption?



                  Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                  Is this a joke to you?
                  The reference to two of the main protagonists from L A Confidential was jocular.

                  However, it would appear that reference and its context was entirely lost on Sparko.
                  "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" Attrib. Seneca 4 BCE - 65 CE

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
                    Yes I also read the article.

                    How will that benefit confronting institutionalised racism and/or corruption?
                    You really are quite dense --- the article spells it out. I thought you said you read the article.

                    The reference to two of the main protagonists from L A Confidential was jocular.

                    However, it would appear that reference and its context was entirely lost on Sparko.
                    So, yeah, this is a joke to you.

                    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                      I think the fact is that the George Floyd situation was so OBVIOUSLY wrong, that no honest cop can defend it at all.

                      The next step should be "DEFUND POLICE UNIONS!" (at least, the ones who very aggressively protect bad cops)
                      Is there any other kind?

                      I'm always still in trouble again

                      "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                      "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I am torn on police unions.

                        On one hand police deserve protection from unjust actions against them. On the other hand, we don't want bad cops to get away with being bad cops.

                        maybe instead of a union, police could contribute to a legal defense fund or have some sort of insurance policy which would help them hire a personal attorney (not affiliated with the police) if they need one in relation to any accusations against them regarding their policing.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                          Is there any other kind?
                          Yes, we have a "police association", but it's part of our overall "excellence in policing" campaign. It represents the officers from wrongful actions, including law suits, but is very clear that it will NOT protect bad behavior, illegal activity, etd.
                          "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Sparko View Post
                            I am torn on police unions.

                            On one hand police deserve protection from unjust actions against them. On the other hand, we don't want bad cops to get away with being bad cops.

                            maybe instead of a union, police could contribute to a legal defense fund or have some sort of insurance policy which would help them hire a personal attorney (not affiliated with the police) if they need one in relation to any accusations against them regarding their policing.
                            Yes, a "Police Association". The "bad unions" come from the whole mafia protection racket - "organized labor".

                            Our own police department, years ago, was being courted by the Teamsters Union - one of the most corrupt on the planet. Our officers said, "not just no, but H E double hockysticks NO".
                            "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

                              You really are quite dense --- the article spells it out.
                              You appear to be reading policy where none exists.

                              With reference to police unions the article states this "We need to curb the power of police unions". It offers no suggestions or policy on how to do that.


                              Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
                              So, yeah, this is a joke to you.
                              Oh dear some always fall on stony ground.

                              "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" Attrib. Seneca 4 BCE - 65 CE

                              Comment

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