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‘Consensual incest’ should be decriminalized, advocates say

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  • ‘Consensual incest’ should be decriminalized, advocates say

    I.... can't say I disagree with them. I don't think consensual incestuous relationships between two adults is any business of the government, let alone something they should be making criminalized.

    I've yet to come across an actual, reasoned, stable argument for them being illegal - every argument against it that I've seen, quickly falls apart or shows flagrant double standards, and typically just ends up being a complicated excuse to say "eww, it grosses me out, so it should be illegal" (plenty of things gross me out, including incest, yet I don't think the government has any place telling people not to do it - incest, guys having sex with guys, transgender people having sex with anyone, fat people having sex with anyone, eating cilantro, etc.).

    If some grown adult wants to marry, or have a romantic/sexual relationship with another grown adult who happens to be related to them, they should be able to.

    https://nypost.com/2021/04/17/consen...ium=SocialFlow

    Consensual incest advocates are rooting for an anonymous New York parent who wants to marry their own adult child.

    Australian Richard Morris, who is pushing to change incest laws in about 60 countries, said he supports the legal push in Manhattan Federal Court and that such behavior between consenting adults “should not be criminalized.”

    He and other advocates have launched about 130 petitions, mostly on change.org, seeking to change incest laws around the world. Most have received little support.

    “We haven’t moved any mountains yet,” he told The Post.

    Morris was inspired to fight for those in consenting incestual relationships, he said, after learning about a Scottish case in which a long-separated father and daughter were reunited, started an affair and were then criminally convicted.

    Fighting for true “marriage equality” is “the right thing to do, isn’t it?” Morris said.

    “It seems to be as unjust as the law that used to imprison gay people, and the law that used to stop people of different races marrying,” he added.

    Keith Pullman, who runs the blog Full Marriage Equality, also cheered on the New York lawsuit.

    “It is absurd to say that an adult can’t consent to marry their parent. That same adult can be sent to war, take on six or seven figures of debt, operate heavy machinery, be sentenced to death by a federal court, and consent to sex with five strangers (and marriage with one of them) but can’t consent to marry someone they love?” he told The Post. “In some of these cases, the genetic parent didn’t raise them and they met for the first time two years ago. Allegations of ‘grooming’ are laughable attempts to deny someone their rights even though it will have no impact on the person objecting.”

  • #2
    My initial gut reaction...


    I'm always still in trouble again

    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
    "Of course, human life begins at fertilization thatís not the argument." --Tassman

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    • #3
      That makes perfect sense once sex is entirely decoupled from its intended function.
      Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. Ė St. John Chrysostom

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      • #4
        Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
        My initial gut reaction...

        I think that's up to the couples on deciding that......

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        • #5
          Assorted remarks...

          I find some forms of incest much more ew-worthy than others.

          I don't concur that reproduction is "the" intended purpose of sex.

          With the availability of genetic counseling, I don't see any secular reason to prohibit incest.
          Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

          Beige Nationalist.

          "Everybody is somebody's heretic."

          Social Justice is usually the opposite of actual justice.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post
            ... eating cilantro, etc.).
            Thanks for the reminder. Hey Siri ... please add cilantro to my grocery list.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post
              I.... can't say I disagree with them. I don't think consensual incestuous relationships between two adults is any business of the government, let alone something they should be making criminalized.

              I've yet to come across an actual, reasoned, stable argument for them being illegal - every argument against it that I've seen, quickly falls apart or shows flagrant double standards, and typically just ends up being a complicated excuse to say "eww, it grosses me out, so it should be illegal" (plenty of things gross me out, including incest, yet I don't think the government has any place telling people not to do it - incest, guys having sex with guys, transgender people having sex with anyone, fat people having sex with anyone, eating cilantro, etc.).

              If some grown adult wants to marry, or have a romantic/sexual relationship with another grown adult who happens to be related to them, they should be able to.

              https://nypost.com/2021/04/17/consen...ium=SocialFlow
              You might find the recent situation in France interesting. https://www.dw.com/en/french-incest-...ate/a-56306263.

              The closeness of the blood relationship is also a factor. Are those who have have expressed the "Urghh" response opposed to second or third cousins having a sexual relationship? Or is the concept of mother/son, father/daughter, or sister/brother incest the taboo most find so upsetting?

              The irony is we interbreed animals for better traits.

              Historically it is probable that many people did "interbreed" to some extent. If we consider the issues surrounding transport it is quite likely that in small villages or remote settlements the population would [in many instances] have been breeding individuals with whom they shared a blood line.

              In some royal houses the belief of keeping the blood "pure" also led to a degree of inbreeding and while Carlos II of Spain is generally the "poster boy" to demonstrate the dangers of too much inbreeding, it should be noted that the Hapsburgs [along with other royal dynasties] also produced many intelligent and competent individuals from unions with their blood relatives.

              And as has been noted [somewhere] go back far enough and we are all related.

              "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" Attrib. Seneca 4 BCE - 65 CE

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                The irony is we interbreed animals for better traits.
                Way to not so subtly endorse eugenics there

                I'm always still in trouble again

                "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                "Of course, human life begins at fertilization thatís not the argument." --Tassman

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                  Way to not so subtly endorse eugenics there
                  Interbreeding in animals is not considered unethical when certain traits are desired. I do not understand how you made the leap from that known fact to your remarks about eugenics.

                  Would you care to elucidate?
                  "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" Attrib. Seneca 4 BCE - 65 CE

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                    Interbreeding in animals is not considered unethical when certain traits are desired. I do not understand how you made the leap from that known fact to your remarks about eugenics.

                    Would you care to elucidate?
                    Re-read what you wrote. You said it was "ironic" that we breed animals for better traits implying we should do so elsewhere as well. Considering that there is only one elsewhere...

                    I'm always still in trouble again

                    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                    "Of course, human life begins at fertilization thatís not the argument." --Tassman

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                      Re-read what you wrote. You said it was "ironic" that we breed animals for better traits implying we should do so elsewhere as well. Considering that there is only one elsewhere...
                      It is ironic that most people find incest [often citing the risks of genetic defects] among humans taboo but I suspect would not be overly bothered to learn that the meat and milk products they consume or the wool products they wear are often provided by animals bred to provide leaner meat, higher milk yields, or better quality fleeces. I also suspect many such persons are not averse to owning pedigree pets.

                      The hairless cat and the British bulldog are examples of inbreeding that have produced animals that would be extremely unlikely to survive in the wild.
                      "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" Attrib. Seneca 4 BCE - 65 CE

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                        It is ironic that most people find incest [often citing the risks of genetic defects] among humans taboo but I suspect would not be overly bothered to learn that the meat and milk products they consume or the wool products they wear are often provided by animals bred to provide leaner meat, higher milk yields, or better quality fleeces. I also suspect many such persons are not averse to owning pedigree pets.

                        The hairless cat and the British bulldog are examples of inbreeding that have produced animals that would be extremely unlikely to survive in the wild.
                        Thank you for providing your little lesson on artificial selection, but it doesn't address the fact that you implied we should apply it to humanity (eugenics) except maybe to further cement the conclusion you want this applied to humanity as well.

                        Two words. Punnett Square.

                        I'm always still in trouble again

                        "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                        "Of course, human life begins at fertilization thatís not the argument." --Tassman

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                          Thank you for providing your little lesson on artificial selection, but it doesn't address the fact that you implied we should apply it to humanity (eugenics) except maybe to further cement the conclusion you want this applied to humanity as well.
                          I implied no such thing. That your eccentric way of thinking inferred that I did so, is an entirely different matter.

                          Let me likewise spell things out to you. My employment of the word "ironic" was in relation to the abhorrence expressed about incest among humans but presumably not about close inbreeding among other animals by humans and for specific purposes.
                          Last edited by Hypatia_Alexandria; 04-18-2021, 07:24 AM.
                          "Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful" Attrib. Seneca 4 BCE - 65 CE

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Juvenal View Post

                            Thanks for the reminder. Hey Siri ... please add cilantro to my grocery list.
                            Deceptive soap flavored leafy greens, they should burn in a pit.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Gondwanaland View Post

                              Deceptive soap flavored leafy greens, they should burn in a pit.
                              It's interesting. The soap/cilantro thing is actually a genetic thing.

                              Comment

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