Announcement

Collapse

Civics 101 Guidelines

Want to argue about politics? Healthcare reform? Taxes? Governments? You've come to the right place!

Try to keep it civil though. The rules still apply here.
See more
See less

Islamic Violence vs Right-Wing Extremism

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #46
    Originally posted by Diogenes View Post

    it was Shuny who wanted to deflect from Islamic violence to right-wring violence. I never mentioned left-wing violence. 2020 showed violence is mainstream for the modern US left. I don't see Republicans setting up bail funds for the Capitol rioters or any other right wing extremist. If we're going to pile up the bodies in general throughout history, Stalin and Mao are a 1-2 punch for victory for the left of the ideological spectrum. If we're going to look at religion and death toll, Islam is the victory.

    The only constant is the human capacity for violence. No one here is defending right-wing violence or extremism.
    I never actually alleged anybody was defending violence RW or otherwise. I pointed out that for some the violence of the Left will always be deemed more heinous than violence of the Right.
    "It ain't necessarily so
    The things that you're liable
    To read in the Bible
    It ain't necessarily so
    ."

    Sportin' Life
    Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

    Comment


    • #47
      Originally posted by Sparko View Post
      Just going by 2020 I can tell that chart is completely wrong.
      If you had looked at the report you might have noticed it was released in June 2020, based on "a data set of 893 incidents that occurred in the United States between January 1994 and May 8, 2020". It could not possibly have included the incidents you refer to.

      Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

      MM: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
      MM on covid-19: We're talking about an illness with a better than 99.9% rate of survival.

      seer: I believe that so called 'compassion' [for starving Palestinian kids] maybe a cover for anti Semitism, ...

      Comment


      • #48
        Originally posted by Sparko View Post
        move goal posts much? September 11 was not domestic terrorism or "right wing" was it?
        Where did I suggest that it was?

        You've joined the Mountain Man club for people who shoot themselves in the foot and claim victory.

        Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

        MM: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
        MM on covid-19: We're talking about an illness with a better than 99.9% rate of survival.

        seer: I believe that so called 'compassion' [for starving Palestinian kids] maybe a cover for anti Semitism, ...

        Comment


        • #49
          Originally posted by seanD View Post
          Their definition of terrorism: "the deliberate use—or threat—of violence by non-state actors in order to achieve political goals and create a broad psychological impact." The fact they don't view any of the violence in 2020 as leftwing terrorism is laughable and pretty much renders their analysis a joke (and obviously partisan driven).
          Please explain (1) how they could have included events that occurred after the report was written, and (2) why your comment isn't even more of a joke (and obviously partisan driven).

          Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

          MM: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
          MM on covid-19: We're talking about an illness with a better than 99.9% rate of survival.

          seer: I believe that so called 'compassion' [for starving Palestinian kids] maybe a cover for anti Semitism, ...

          Comment


          • #50
            Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
            One of the biggest problems with those statistics is that many terroristic actions by the left are often not treated as being acts of terrorism but rather dismissed as simple crimes.

            When a supporter of BLM shot and killed five police officers (wounding seven more along with two civilians) during a BLM protest in Dallas[1], it was dismissed as a regular crime. When another one ambushes and kills two sitting in their car in New York[2], it was again regarded as a regular crime.

            Likewise, when a shooter entered the Family Research Council's Washington D.C. headquarters in 2012 and opening fire (because the Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC) had put them on their list of anti-gay "hate groups"), wounding one before being tackled by a security guard, it was regarded as a regular crime but when another idiot entered Comet Ping Pong Pizzeria also in D.C. brandishing a rifle and shooting "through the lock of a closet, damaging a computer" and where nobody was injured (because of a false internet rumor they were part of a child sex trafficking ring) that was deemed to be part of a terrorist conspiracy.[3]

            To better just how screwed up and out of touch with reality the data keeping really is, the Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC), the source for many right-wing terrorist acts, list the 2016 Orlando nightclub shooting by Omar Mateen the most deadly Islamic terror attack since 9/11, along with the shootings of police officers by black anti-white radicals as "right-wing" plots.
            Do those criticisms also apply to the report I cited, or are you simply tossing out random problems with the SPLC''s data in an attempt at guilt by association?
            Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

            MM: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
            MM on covid-19: We're talking about an illness with a better than 99.9% rate of survival.

            seer: I believe that so called 'compassion' [for starving Palestinian kids] maybe a cover for anti Semitism, ...

            Comment


            • #51
              Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
              Or is that more evidence of the Lügenpresse? I honestly don't know. However, scenes of burning buildings. looted shops, and people hitting one another makes for far more "exciting" television than images of peaceful protesters with placards shouting slogans.
              You didn't have to worry about which one was taking place after the first week or so as the peaceful protests pretty much disappeared and what you had left was rioting. But the MSM remained dutifully true to the narrative, reporting on "mostly peaceful protests" while standing in front of buildings set ablaze.

              909abebc-78a7-40b5-a751-53d0d4c1a817.jpg
              MSNBC's Ali Velshi standing in front of the first police department that rioters tried out what soon would be a favorite trick of theirs. First they try to barricade those inside so they can't get out and then they set the building on fire in hopes of burning all of those trapped inside alive. Great wholesome fun for the whole family. Those inside even get to call and text loved ones saying goodbye because they figure that they're going to die.


              519627.jpg
              IIRC, this was also the one where the reporter nonchalantly noted that he could see four more fires from where he's standing




              We had cities where this took place night after night for several months straight while the MSM kept calling them protests rather than what they were. We had actual armed insurgents seize blocks and declaring them autonomous zones that were no longer under government authority (literal armed insurrections), which were patrolled by armed antifa/BLM thugs who had a nasty habit of opening fire on anyone who approached "their turf." Four were shot, with two killed in separate incidents in Seattle, and a little girl was shot and killed in Atlanta when her mother tried to turn her car around in a parking lot next to one of these "occupied" zones there.

              But for some reason they'll be very unlikely included in statistics of leftwing violence.
              Last edited by rogue06; 03-03-2021, 06:26 AM.

              I'm always still in trouble again

              "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
              "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
              "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

              Comment


              • #52
                Originally posted by Roy View Post
                Do those criticisms also apply to the report I cited, or are you simply tossing out random problems with the SPLC''s data in an attempt at guilt by association?
                You'll note that I pointed out not just the SPLC but another source for these statistics. Both have a habit of labeling things as "right wing violence" when they're anything but and then make it into the statistics that you cite.

                I'm always still in trouble again

                "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                Comment


                • #53
                  Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                  How "right-wing violence" as compared to "left-wing violence" gets defined is one of the biggest issues in trying to get accurate numbers.
                  There's also the problem that "right-wingers" who commit violence are considered representative, while "left-wingers" who commit violence are considered outliers (such as the "mostly peaceful protests" lie).
                  Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                  But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                  Than a fool in the eyes of God


                  From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                    You didn't have to worry about which one was taking place after the first week or so as the peaceful protests pretty much disappeared and what you had left was rioting. But the MSM remained dutifully true to the narrative, reporting on "mostly peaceful protests" while standing in front of buildings set ablaze.

                    909abebc-78a7-40b5-a751-53d0d4c1a817.jpg
                    MSNBC's Ali Velshi standing in front of the first police department that rioters tried out what soon would be a favorite trick of theirs. First they try to barricade those inside so they can't get out and then they set the building on fire in hopes of burning all of those trapped inside alive. Great wholesome fun for the whole family. Those inside even get to call and text loved ones saying goodbye because they figure that they're going to die.


                    519627.jpg
                    IIRC, this was also the one where the reporter nonchalantly noted that he could see four more fires from where he's standing




                    We had cities where this took place night after night for several months straight while the MSM kept calling them protests rather than what they were. We had actual armed insurgents seize blocks and declaring them autonomous zones that were no longer under government authority (literal armed insurrections), which were patrolled by armed antifa/BLM thugs who had a nasty habit of opening fire on anyone who approached "their turf." Four were shot, with two killed in separate incidents in Seattle, and a little girl was shot and killed in Atlanta when her mother tried to turn her car around in a parking lot next to one of these "occupied" zones there.

                    But for some reason they'll be very unlikely included in statistics of leftwing violence.
                    Your fixation on certain events is noted.

                    .
                    "It ain't necessarily so
                    The things that you're liable
                    To read in the Bible
                    It ain't necessarily so
                    ."

                    Sportin' Life
                    Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                      Do those criticisms also apply to the report I cited, or are you simply tossing out random problems with the SPLC''s data in an attempt at guilt by association?
                      You'll note that I pointed out not just the SPLC but another source for these statistics. Both have a habit of labeling things as "right wing violence" when they're anything but and then make it into the statistics that you cite.
                      I'll note instead that you have not even attempted to see whether your criticisms apply to the statistics I cited, and are instead persisting with your "guilt by association" fallacy.
                      Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

                      MM: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
                      MM on covid-19: We're talking about an illness with a better than 99.9% rate of survival.

                      seer: I believe that so called 'compassion' [for starving Palestinian kids] maybe a cover for anti Semitism, ...

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                        Your fixation on certain events is noted.

                        .
                        "Certain events" that took place for several months on end and largely make what happened on January 6th of this year look like amateur hour.

                        I'm always still in trouble again

                        "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                        "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                        "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Roy View Post
                          I'll note instead that you have not even attempted to see whether your criticisms apply to the statistics I cited, and are instead persisting with your "guilt by association" fallacy.
                          The SPLC is a if not the primary source for those who gather these statistics (Greg Correll is another one, but not as prominent). If they mess up this badly it is going to color the conclusions of those who rely on them.

                          I'm always still in trouble again

                          "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                          "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                          "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
                            The Bible is a veritable cornucopia providing source material for so many varying and diverse viewpoints.
                            While it's true that the words of the Bible are not immune to being twisted to support whatever agenda a person wants, the range of legitimate interpretations is, in fact, very narrow.
                            Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                            But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                            Than a fool in the eyes of God


                            From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Originally posted by kccd View Post

                              Actually the right has consistently tried to blame right wing violence on lefties. Republican Congressmen did it today when the FBI Director testified about Jan 6. Although he kept insisting there was no evidence of involvement by antifa or BLM or other left wing instigators, these Congressmen kept asking about left wing involvement.

                              Our intel agencies have tried to warn about right wing terrorism in the USA since before McVeigh, but Republicans will have none of it, even as example after example occurs and the body count goes up.
                              No, SOME right wingers have tried to claim that the riot was caused by Antifa infiltrators. But they are just in denial. Some liberals were trying to claim the same thing last summer by saying Trump supporters were infiltrating the demonstrations and starting the violence. You will always have people like that. But even they were not defending the violence. They were just shifting the blame. They still wanted all of those responsible to be arrested.


                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                                What "lies" did "the left" make up about the events of 6 January?
                                https://theologyweb.com/campus/forum...nue-to-unravel
                                https://theologyweb.com/campus/forum...t-ashli-babbit

                                Comment

                                Related Threads

                                Collapse

                                Topics Statistics Last Post
                                Started by little_monkey, 03-27-2024, 04:19 PM
                                16 responses
                                179 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post One Bad Pig  
                                Started by whag, 03-26-2024, 04:38 PM
                                53 responses
                                413 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post Mountain Man  
                                Started by rogue06, 03-26-2024, 11:45 AM
                                25 responses
                                114 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post rogue06
                                by rogue06
                                 
                                Started by Hypatia_Alexandria, 03-26-2024, 09:21 AM
                                33 responses
                                198 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post Roy
                                by Roy
                                 
                                Started by Hypatia_Alexandria, 03-26-2024, 08:34 AM
                                84 responses
                                386 views
                                0 likes
                                Last Post JimL
                                by JimL
                                 
                                Working...
                                X