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Islamic Violence vs Right-Wing Extremism

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Roy View Post
    From this report, the breakdown of US domestic terrorism sources is:
    TNT_Graphics_Web-01.jpg

    "Between 1994 and 2020, there were 893 terrorist attacks and plots in the United States. Overall, right-wing terrorists perpetrated the majority—57 percent—of all attacks and plots during this period, compared to 25 percent committed by left-wing terrorists, 15 percent by religious terrorists, 3 percent by ethnonationalists, and 0.7 percent by terrorists with other motives."
    Please include victim count as per the OP's example.
    P1) If , then I win.

    P2)

    C) I win.

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by Diogenes View Post

      Please include victim count as per the OP's example.
      Couldn't you find them?

      "In analyzing fatalities from terrorist attacks, religious terrorism has killed the largest number of individuals—3,086 people—primarily due to the attacks on September 11, 2001, which caused 2,977 deaths.10 The magnitude of this death toll fundamentally shaped U.S. counterterrorism policy over the past two decades. In comparison, right-wing terrorist attacks caused 335 deaths, left-wing attacks caused 22 deaths, and ethnonationalist terrorists caused 5 deaths.

      To evaluate the ongoing threat from different types of terrorists, however, it is useful to consider the proportion of fatalities attributed to each type of perpetrator annually. In 14 of the 21 years between 1994 and 2019 in which fatal terrorist attacks occurred, the majority of deaths resulted from right-wing attacks. In eight of these years, right-wing attackers caused all of the fatalities, and in three more—including 2018 and 2019—they were responsible for more than 90 percent of annual fatalities.11 Therefore, while religious terrorists caused the largest number of total fatalities, right-wing attackers were most likely to cause more deaths in a given year."


      Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

      MM: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
      MM on covid-19: We're talking about an illness with a better than 99.9% rate of survival.

      seer: I believe that so called 'compassion' [for starving Palestinian kids] maybe a cover for anti Semitism, ...

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by mossrose View Post
        Shuny, let me explain.

        Far right groups that call themselves "Christians" and do violent things are not.

        Got it? Good.
        They believed [and believe themselves] to be Christians and will cite biblical texts to justify their actions. The Bible is a veritable cornucopia providing source material for so many varying and diverse viewpoints.
        "It ain't necessarily so
        The things that you're liable
        To read in the Bible
        It ain't necessarily so
        ."

        Sportin' Life
        Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

          They believed [and believe themselves] to be Christians and will cite biblical texts to justify their actions. The Bible is a veritable cornucopia providing source material for so many varying and diverse viewpoints.
          As rogue put it so well, they aren't Christians.


          Securely anchored to the Rock amid every storm of trial, testing or tribulation.

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by Roy View Post
            Couldn't you find them?

            "In analyzing fatalities from terrorist attacks, religious terrorism has killed the largest number of individuals—3,086 people—primarily due to the attacks on September 11, 2001, which caused 2,977 deaths.10 The magnitude of this death toll fundamentally shaped U.S. counterterrorism policy over the past two decades. In comparison, right-wing terrorist attacks caused 335 deaths, left-wing attacks caused 22 deaths, and ethnonationalist terrorists caused 5 deaths.

            To evaluate the ongoing threat from different types of terrorists, however, it is useful to consider the proportion of fatalities attributed to each type of perpetrator annually. In 14 of the 21 years between 1994 and 2019 in which fatal terrorist attacks occurred, the majority of deaths resulted from right-wing attacks. In eight of these years, right-wing attackers caused all of the fatalities, and in three more—including 2018 and 2019—they were responsible for more than 90 percent of annual fatalities.11 Therefore, while religious terrorists caused the largest number of total fatalities, right-wing attackers were most likely to cause more deaths in a given year."

            This is also an interesting snippet.

            Third, right-wing extremists have adopted some foreign terrorist organization tactics, though al-Qaeda and other groups have also adopted tactics developed by right-wing movements. In a June 2019 online post, a member of the Atomwaffen Division (AWD) stated, “the culture of martyrdom and insurgency within groups like the Taliban and ISIS is something to admire and reproduce in the neo-Nazi terror movement.”18 Similarly, the Base—a loosely organized neo-Nazi accelerationist movement which shares the English-language name for al-Qaeda—uses a vetting process to screen potential recruits, similar to the methods of al-Qaeda.

            Back in the seventies and eighties the PFLP, the PLO, and Gaddafi, were training RAF and IRA militants.

            Now we see cross fertilisation among the extreme Right Wing and religious fundamentalism. One wonders when the first neo-Nazi suicide bombing will occur.
            "It ain't necessarily so
            The things that you're liable
            To read in the Bible
            It ain't necessarily so
            ."

            Sportin' Life
            Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Roy View Post
              Couldn't you find them?
              I have provided what I claimed. You can do the same.

              [QUOTE]"In analyzing fatalities from terrorist attacks, religious terrorism has killed the largest number of individuals—3,086 people—primarily due to the attacks on September 11, 2001, which caused 2,977 deaths.10 The magnitude of this death toll fundamentally shaped U.S. counterterrorism policy over the past two decades. In comparison, right-wing terrorist attacks caused 335 deaths, left-wing attacks caused 22 deaths, and ethnonationalist terrorists caused 5 deaths.

              To evaluate the ongoing threat from different types of terrorists, however, it is useful to consider the proportion of fatalities attributed to each type of perpetrator annually. In 14 of the 21 years between 1994 and 2019 in which fatal terrorist attacks occurred, the majority of deaths resulted from right-wing attacks. In eight of these years, right-wing attackers caused all of the fatalities, and in three more—including 2018 and 2019—they were responsible for more than 90 percent of annual fatalities.11 Therefore, while religious terrorists caused the largest number of total fatalities, right-wing attackers were most likely to cause more deaths in a given year."
              From CSIS as well"

              Amid growing concern about a rise in right-wing terrorism in Europe and worldwide, there is an ongoing debate about the severity of this threat. Analysis of a CSIS data set of over 2,200 terrorist incidents in Europe between 2009 and 2020 found that 69.3 percent of fatalities were from jihadists, compared to only 21.8 percent from right-wing individuals or networks, 6.9 percent from ethno-nationalists, and 2.0 percent from left-wing actors. This suggests that despite a notable increase in the number of right-wing terrorist incidents during the past five years, jihadist terrorism continues to be the most lethal threat to Europe.

              The original claim was:

              Originally posted by Diogenes View Post

              Edit: Muslims pose a much more credible threat than Christians.
              Here, I specify religion, not political, ideology as the motivation in question. Nobody has said right-wing extremism isn't a threat.

              Shuny hijacked that post to re divert to right-wing extremism, which he did here:


              Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

              Not in the US. Right Wing violence in the US exceeds all other causes of violence including Islamic violence. It includes violence against Muslims and those that look like Muslims.

              https://archives.fbi.gov/archives/ne...-united-states

              If you want to show stats on when right-wingers yelled "Deus vult" before doing something, that would be nice, but then we have the issue that it's the progressive Muslims who don't take the Qur'an's violence serious are in the minority whereas violence is a minority view of self-described Christians.
              P1) If , then I win.

              P2)

              C) I win.

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Roy View Post
                From this report, the breakdown of US domestic terrorism sources is:
                TNT_Graphics_Web-01.jpg

                "Between 1994 and 2020, there were 893 terrorist attacks and plots in the United States. Overall, right-wing terrorists perpetrated the majority—57 percent—of all attacks and plots during this period, compared to 25 percent committed by left-wing terrorists, 15 percent by religious terrorists, 3 percent by ethnonationalists, and 0.7 percent by terrorists with other motives."
                Just going by 2020 I can tell that chart is completely wrong. I can think of one right wing terrorism attempt in 2020 (the planned kidnapping of Governor Whitmer, but they stopped it before it happened so that doesn't count), but I remember a heck of a lot of left wing terrorism as they tried to burn entire cities while rioting and looting. and it is still going on in places like Portland. Try again.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by Sparko View Post

                  Just going by 2020 I can tell that chart is completely wrong. I can think of one right wing terrorism attempt in 2020 (the planned kidnapping of Governor Whitmer, but they stopped it before it happened so that doesn't count), but I remember a heck of a lot of left wing terrorism as they tried to burn entire cities while rioting and looting. and it is still going on in places like Portland. Try again.
                  That's not "rioting" or "terrorism", that's "mostly peaceful protests".

                  For the sarcastically impaired the following is said in jest

                  To the re-education camp with you!.

                  P1) If , then I win.

                  P2)

                  C) I win.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Roy View Post
                    Couldn't you find them?

                    "In analyzing fatalities from terrorist attacks, religious terrorism has killed the largest number of individuals—3,086 people—primarily due to the attacks on September 11, 2001, which caused 2,977 deaths.10 The magnitude of this death toll fundamentally shaped U.S. counterterrorism policy over the past two decades. In comparison, right-wing terrorist attacks caused 335 deaths, left-wing attacks caused 22 deaths, and ethnonationalist terrorists caused 5 deaths.

                    To evaluate the ongoing threat from different types of terrorists, however, it is useful to consider the proportion of fatalities attributed to each type of perpetrator annually. In 14 of the 21 years between 1994 and 2019 in which fatal terrorist attacks occurred, the majority of deaths resulted from right-wing attacks. In eight of these years, right-wing attackers caused all of the fatalities, and in three more—including 2018 and 2019—they were responsible for more than 90 percent of annual fatalities.11 Therefore, while religious terrorists caused the largest number of total fatalities, right-wing attackers were most likely to cause more deaths in a given year."

                    move goal posts much? September 11 was not domestic terrorism or "right wing" was it?

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Diogenes View Post

                      That's not "rioting" or "terrorism", that's "mostly peaceful protests".

                      For the sarcastically impaired the following is said in jest

                      To the re-education camp with you!.

                      Ah. I forget. Just like racism is just something white people do, violence is only something right wingers do.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Sparko View Post

                        Just going by 2020 I can tell that chart is completely wrong. I can think of one right wing terrorism attempt in 2020 (the planned kidnapping of Governor Whitmer, but they stopped it before it happened so that doesn't count), but I remember a heck of a lot of left wing terrorism as they tried to burn entire cities while rioting and looting. and it is still going on in places like Portland. Try again.
                        The whole Whitmer incident is being misrepresented by left. Those were supposedly a mixture of anarchist and boogaloo boys. They aren't exactly rightwing, in fact, a lot of boogaloo boys actually support anitfa and BLM. It isn't a cut and dry issue in spite of MSM making it that way. Don't buy into the leftist narrative and do your own research, you'll be better off.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by seanD View Post

                          The whole Whitmer incident is being misrepresented by left. Those were supposedly a mixture of anarchist and boogaloo boys. They aren't exactly rightwing, in fact, a lot of boogaloo boys actually support anitfa and BLM. It isn't a cut and dry issue in spite of MSM making it that way. Don't buy into the leftist narrative and do your own research, you'll be better off.
                          I was throwing him a bone.

                          But that chart was so far off it was ridiculous. Not even trying to hide their bias. NO left wing terrorism in 2020? Really? LOL. We have had over 4 years of politically motivated violence [their definition of domestic terrorism] by the left since Trump was elected. But they don't count any of it.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Roy View Post
                            From this report, the breakdown of US domestic terrorism sources is:
                            TNT_Graphics_Web-01.jpg

                            "Between 1994 and 2020, there were 893 terrorist attacks and plots in the United States. Overall, right-wing terrorists perpetrated the majority—57 percent—of all attacks and plots during this period, compared to 25 percent committed by left-wing terrorists, 15 percent by religious terrorists, 3 percent by ethnonationalists, and 0.7 percent by terrorists with other motives."
                            Their definition of terrorism: "the deliberate use—or threat—of violence by non-state actors in order to achieve political goals and create a broad psychological impact." The fact they don't view any of the violence in 2020 as leftwing terrorism is laughable and pretty much renders their analysis a joke (and obviously partisan driven).

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Roy View Post
                              From this report, the breakdown of US domestic terrorism sources is:
                              TNT_Graphics_Web-01.jpg

                              "Between 1994 and 2020, there were 893 terrorist attacks and plots in the United States. Overall, right-wing terrorists perpetrated the majority—57 percent—of all attacks and plots during this period, compared to 25 percent committed by left-wing terrorists, 15 percent by religious terrorists, 3 percent by ethnonationalists, and 0.7 percent by terrorists with other motives."
                              One of the biggest problems with those statistics is that many terroristic actions by the left are often not treated as being acts of terrorism but rather dismissed as simple crimes.

                              When a supporter of BLM shot and killed five police officers (wounding seven more along with two civilians) during a BLM protest in Dallas[1], it was dismissed as a regular crime. When another one ambushes and kills two sitting in their car in New York[2], it was again regarded as a regular crime.

                              Likewise, when a shooter entered the Family Research Council's Washington D.C. headquarters in 2012 and opening fire (because the Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC) had put them on their list of anti-gay "hate groups"), wounding one before being tackled by a security guard, it was regarded as a regular crime but when another idiot entered Comet Ping Pong Pizzeria also in D.C. brandishing a rifle and shooting "through the lock of a closet, damaging a computer" and where nobody was injured (because of a false internet rumor they were part of a child sex trafficking ring) that was deemed to be part of a terrorist conspiracy.[3]

                              To better just how screwed up and out of touch with reality the data keeping really is, the Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC), the source for many right-wing terrorist acts, list the 2016 Orlando nightclub shooting by Omar Mateen the most deadly Islamic terror attack since 9/11, along with the shootings of police officers by black anti-white radicals as "right-wing" plots.

                              And it isn't just the SPLC. From a thread about a supposed Christian terrorist who supposedly brought a bomb to an abortion center (In reality there isn't a shred of evidence that he was a Christian, he had actually come to apply for a job and had a couple of fire crackers in a pill bottle stuffed in his backpack and the police investigation "absolutely ruled out" any intent for anti-abortion violence), which serves as an example of what sort of stuff you can find listed as "rightwing terrorism," I posted this about another prominent source for these statistics
                              Originally posted by rogue06 View Post

                              One of the big problems is that several of the groups that keep track of political violence in the U.S., and who's statistics are uncritically used by numerous media outlets, exercise no consistency in compiling their statistics and often make unwarranted conclusions. For instance, one "expert" frequently cited by unabashedly liberal/progressive sources is Greg Correll who devised what he calls the "Right & Left Violence: Timeline" of which the following graphic has been attached on several websites.

                              1.jpg

                              Aside from the fact that Correll does not assign political party (not all leftists are Democrats and not all right-wingers are Republicans), it has several significant problems. First, it assigns all racist attacks by whites to the "right" but does not assign a single racist attacks by blacks to the "left." Further every attack against Jews committed by a white person is automatically assigned to being committed by the right when in recent decades it has been the left that has become increasingly bigoted and intolerant toward Jews while the right -- specifically the religious right -- who has sought to embrace them as allies.

                              Correll also lists a large number of violent attacks committed in recent years as having been done by people on the right when even the most cursory check reveals this is not the case. A few examples.
                              Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                              • The 2014 Las Vegas shooting spree committed by Jerad and Amanda Miller in which 5 died are labelled as having been done by right-wingers who supported the Patriot movement but in reality they were leftist anti-government types heavily involved in the Occupy movement
                              • The 2009 Holocaust Memorial Museum shooting committed by James Wenneker von Brunn a racist Holocaust denier. Must have been a right-winger right? Not exactly. He was anti-Christian (wrote of "the insane teachings of Jesus" and the "hoax" of Christianity), claimed 9/11 was an inside job, hated Republicans (especially Bush, McCain and anyone he thought was a "neo-con"), loathed Fox News and was a socialist[1]. Sounds like someone more likely employed by the current Administration than any sort of conservative
                              • The 2015 Chapel Hill, North Carolina shootings committed by Craig Hicks was called an example of right wing terrorism in spite of the fact that the perpetrator was actually a a self-described militant atheist (his facebook page was loaded with photos, memes and posts that mocked Christianity) and who is a fan of MSNBC's Rachel Maddow, the websites "Mitt Romney Sucks" and "Organization for Educating Misinformed Tea Party Patriots" as well as the Southern Poverty Law Center (who IIRC was quick to call the shooting a "hate crime" since the victims were Muslim[2]) and various LGBT Ally groups. And definitely a pro-abortion supporter


                              There are other examples but these ought to suffice to make the point.







                              1. Albeit of a strange sort. He tried to distance his belief from Marxism and communism because those he declared were inspired by Jews who he despised. He explained his brand of socialism in a piece he called Kill the Best Gentiles:
                              WESTERN SOCIALISM, unlike Marxism/Communism and Capitalism, emanates not from Reason alone but from the ETHOS OF THE WEST. It expresses the instinctive and Intuitive feelings UNIQUE to the Aryan Nation.


                              2. Hicks Facebook page, which, as noted, constantly mocks Christianity, also repeatedly explicitly promotes freedom of religion for Muslims, including supporting the building of the "Ground Zero" Mosque in New York City.












                              1. the shooter had declared that he had wanted to kill white people, especially white officers and his Facebook page showed that he supported the New Black Panther Party. During the standoff he told police negotiators that "he was upset about Black Lives Matter"

                              2. the shooter himself made the connection clear posting on Instagram right before he stood outside the patrol car and fired his weapon several times through the front passenger window, striking both Wenjian Liu and Rafael Ramos (who were working overtime as part of an anti-terrorism drill) in the neck and head.





                              Immediately after, in Ferguson when news of the NYPD slayings hit, BLM protesters celebrated by chanting "Pigs in a blanket!" And this also took place shortly after a protest down Fifth Avenue in NYC where they were chanting "What do we want? Dead cops. When do we want it? Now."





                              3. What few mention is that the conspiracy long ago left the province of lunatics on the far right and is now predominant spread by teens on TikTok "who don't otherwise fit a right-wing conspiracy theorist mold" and are largely supporters of BLM.
                              Last edited by rogue06; 03-02-2021, 12:25 PM. Reason: keeps dividing older post into two separate ones

                              I'm always still in trouble again

                              "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                              "Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
                              "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Roy View Post
                                Couldn't you find them?

                                "In analyzing fatalities from terrorist attacks, religious terrorism has killed the largest number of individuals—3,086 people—primarily due to the attacks on September 11, 2001, which caused 2,977 deaths.10 The magnitude of this death toll fundamentally shaped U.S. counterterrorism policy over the past two decades. In comparison, right-wing terrorist attacks caused 335 deaths, left-wing attacks caused 22 deaths, and ethnonationalist terrorists caused 5 deaths.

                                To evaluate the ongoing threat from different types of terrorists, however, it is useful to consider the proportion of fatalities attributed to each type of perpetrator annually. In 14 of the 21 years between 1994 and 2019 in which fatal terrorist attacks occurred, the majority of deaths resulted from right-wing attacks. In eight of these years, right-wing attackers caused all of the fatalities, and in three more—including 2018 and 2019—they were responsible for more than 90 percent of annual fatalities.11 Therefore, while religious terrorists caused the largest number of total fatalities, right-wing attackers were most likely to cause more deaths in a given year."

                                You do realise that some here will never concede that domestic US RW violence can ever be quite as heinous as domestic US LW violence.

                                Excuses and defensive comments will continue to be made to contend that the Left is always far worse.

                                "It ain't necessarily so
                                The things that you're liable
                                To read in the Bible
                                It ain't necessarily so
                                ."

                                Sportin' Life
                                Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

                                Comment

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