Originally posted by Diogenes
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Dumb Down All Our Kids...
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Originally posted by Stoic View Post
So you're saying that Black and Hispanic kids are too lazy to apply for the program?
What I find interesting is that Whites and Asians were group together and not given separately.P1) If , then I win.
P2)
C) I win.
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Originally posted by kccd View Post
I am appalled by this.
My own son started in our county math and science magnet program in 4th grade. He had to go to schools outside our district for the rest of elementary school, middle school and high school. This was perfect for him. He finished the normal "advanced" high school math curriculum as a freshman in high school which enabled him to take all sorts of advanced classes in math and also in physics. He went to the top engineering university in the US. This program was highly competitive and some kids, not prepared for this level of competition, dropped out. Rather than setting racial quotas or terminating such programs, the effort should be made to identify talented kids early, in all schools, and give them the more advanced challenges they need.
I also do not think special programs should only be geared to the high-achieving students. There should also be special resources for struggling students, handicapped students, and for kids with special talents in music or athletics, etc.
That also happened in the Christian School in which I served - the advanced students got extra credit for helping the struggling students.The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.
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Originally posted by seer View Post
Vouchers!
*yeah, I'm being facetious, but only a tiny bitThe first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.
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Originally posted by Stoic View PostSo you're saying that Black and Hispanic kids are too lazy to apply for the program?
I really think we should get back to vocational education in high school, and encourage trade schools for those who don't specifically need college for their chosen vocation.
The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.
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Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post
AMEN!!! Let the parents decide to send their students to the commie-run* public schools, or the schools that are actually educating young people.
*yeah, I'm being facetious, but only a tiny bit
This bit from Al Shanker, president of the United Federation of Teachers and then the American Federation of Teachers, in 1990
It is time to admit that public education operates like a planned economy. It's a bureaucratic system where everybody's role is spelled out in advance, and there are few incentives for innovation and productivity. It's not a surprise when a school system doesn't improve. It more resembles a Communist economy than our own market economy.
I'm always still in trouble again
"You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
"Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
"Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman
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Originally posted by Diogenes View Post
Were there not white kids who chose not to apply? If an individual doesn't want to do the extra work no matter what their race, that's their business. That was one possible reason. They could simply be uninterested in the advanced curricula. We don't know the makeup of the individuals who received the invitation or the reason why individuals chose not to apply. The justification for stopping the program was racial composition. They're depriving future students the advanced curricula because the equal opportunity doesn't have the racial statistics they want. I feel bad for the kids, despite race, who wanted the program but will now be deprived of it because of ideology.
What I find interesting is that Whites and Asians were group together and not given separately.
I'm always still in trouble again
"You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
"Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
"Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman
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Originally posted by Sparko View PostIf participation was driven by students applying, then I don't see any discrimination going on.
I'm always still in trouble again
"You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
"Overall I would rate the withdrawal from Afghanistan as by far the best thing Biden's done" --Starlight
"Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman
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Originally posted by rogue06 View PostThis again reminds me of something that the former editor of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution, Cynthia Tucker used to frequently bring up. Tucker, who is black and quite liberal, wrote in several columns about how both she and her sister were regularly teased by their friends and classmates for "acting white" when they were growing up. What she meant by that was simply doing their homework and speaking proper English -- things their mother insisted upon.P1) If , then I win.
P2)
C) I win.
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“Go into any inner city neighborhood, and folks will tell you that government alone can’t teach kids to learn. They know that parents have to parent, that children can’t achieve unless we raise their expectations and turn off the television sets and eradicate the slander that says a black youth with a book is acting white.”
Senator Barack Obama, 2004 Democratic National Convention Keynote AddressAtheism is the cult of death, the death of hope. The universe is doomed, you are doomed, the only thing that remains is to await your execution...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbnueb2OI4o&t=3s
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Originally posted by seer View Post“Go into any inner city neighborhood, and folks will tell you that government alone can’t teach kids to learn. They know that parents have to parent, that children can’t achieve unless we raise their expectations and turn off the television sets and eradicate the slander that says a black youth with a book is acting white.”
Senator Barack Obama, 2004 Democratic National Convention Keynote Address
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Originally posted by kccd View Post
We do not know how many of the 453 students who were invited were minorities.
It actually seems like a fair admissions process - you take a test, and those getting a certain score are subject to a lottery.
Where the unfairness comes in is in the substandard resources and preparation of kids in schools in minority neighborhoods who are at a disadvantage in taking that test.
Test -> Lottery -> Letters -> Application ->Enrollment
Where the disparity comes into the process is where the focus should be.
If it appears in test results, you have a systemic issue you need to address in overall achievement, resources, etc. This requires intervention, but the program should survive for those who qualify.
If it appears in the lottery, you have a real problem. It's unlikely to have happened by chance, and suggests someone in the administration is discriminating. Here, I would shut the program down, fire who needs to be fired, and look at restarting it only after appropriate safeguards have been put into place.
If it appears in the letters phase, see the previous step.
If it appears in the application phase, you have a different problem. Here, you have self selection and a perception problem. Outreach needs to be done, and find out WHY there's a disparity in those applying. Why are black's and hispanics not applying to your program? What are their concerns, how can you get more engagement. You may need to adjust your program, but you shouldn't cancel it as it, in and of itself is not a problem.
From the numbers provided, this isn't an enrollment issue. The numbers don't change enough for the disparity to have appeared at this stage. However, if it did appear, it would be a similar issue to the last step.
There's two steps here where you'd have a mustache twirling villain involved. One step (most likely) where you have systemic disparities that need to be addressed. And two steps where you have a perception/engagement issue that has to be addressed.
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