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  • And now it's Wikipedia

    Source: Inside Wikipedia's leftist bias: socialism pages whitewashed, communist atrocities buried


    "The days of Wikipedia's robust commitment to neutrality are long gone," co-founder Larry Sanger said.

    Big tech has faced repeated accusations of bias and censorship, but one platform has escaped much scrutiny: Wikipedia.

    The online encyclopedia, which claims "anyone can edit", is the 13th most popular website in the world, according to Alexa's web rankings. Google gives it special placement in search results.

    But critics -- including Wikipedia co-founder Larry Sanger -- tell Fox News that many Wikipedia pages have become merely left-wing advocacy essays.

    "The days of Wikipedia's robust commitment to neutrality are long gone," co-founder Larry Sanger said.

    "Wikipedia's ideological and religious bias is real and troubling, particularly in a resource that continues to be treated by many as an unbiased reference work," he added.

    WIKIPEDIA RESTRICTS EDITS TO LINCOLN PROJECT PAGE AMID SEX SCANDAL

    Wikipedia pages related to socialism and communism contain stark examples.

    The two main pages for "Socialism" and "Communism" span a massive 28,000 words, and yet they contain no discussion of the genocides committed by socialist and communist regimes, in which tens of millions of people were murdered and starved.

    "The omission of large-scale mass murder, slave labor, and man-made famines is negligent and deeply misleading," economics professor Bryan Caplan, who has studied the history of communism, told Fox News.

    The pages include plenty of history, Caplan noted, and are not confined to just philosophical claims. But the history focuses on flattering claims.

    Wikipedia’s Socialism page announces: "The Soviet era saw some of the most significant technological achievements of the 20th century."

    It ignores a man-made famine in which Soviet dictator Joseph Stalin commandeered the food from regions like Ukraine and Kazakhstan, leaving millions to starve to death even as the Soviet Union exported grain to foreign countries.

    Asked for comment, a Wikimedia Foundation spokesperson sent a statement noting that "Wikipedia is a living, breathing project, and is always evolving just as our shared understanding of a topic does." The response also noted that the foundation does not directly control content on Wikipedia, which is written by volunteer editors. The statement did not address any specific criticisms of the content.

    The Wikipedia socialism page also mentions China’s Communist history, but only begins its description in 1976, after Mao Zedong’s reign of terror had already killed tens of millions.

    "After Mao Zedong's death in 1976... China's economic performance pulled an estimated 150 million peasants out of poverty," the encyclopedia says.

    The article fails to mention Mao’s prior communist programs such as his "Great Leap Forward", in which private farming was abolished, leading to mass famine that killed tens of millions.

    It also neglects to mention Mao’s "Cultural Revolution", in which, according to the History Channel, "Millions of young radicals who formed the paramilitary Red Guards shut down schools, destroyed religious and cultural relics and killed intellectuals and party elites believed to be anti-revolutionaries."

    Wikipedia does maintain less central sub-pages that contain facts such as those, as well as a page titled "Mass killings under communist regimes." But it gets no discussion on the main pages; merely a stray link at the very end under a "see also" heading.

    Chinese-American immigrant Lily Tang Williams, who lived through Mao’s cultural revolution, says she’s outraged by Wikipedia’s focus.

    "Who writes this stuff? Trying to whitewash crimes against humanity?" she asked.

    "What about students, who now will not know the real history of what happened? Or even teachers who won’t know?" she asked. Tang Williams volunteers at schools to teach kids about the history of communism in China, and her personal experience with it. She also presents it on her YouTube channel.

    "I went through the entire 10 years of Mao’s Cultural Revolution, as child. I witnessed it," she said. "Of course I was extremely brainwashed -- we just did not know any truths at all, it was like living on a concentration camp. 6:30am every morning a loudspeaker comes on and tells you about the news and chants ‘long live chairman Mao.’ The memory of my childhood… we were hungry all the time. It was constant chaos."

    The two main Socialism and Capitalism pages also fail to note any of the atrocities committed by other socialist and communist regimes, from Venezuela, Cuba, Nicaragua, Cambodia, or North Korea, among others.

    Wikipedia bills itself as the "the free encyclopedia that anyone can edit." But experienced Wikipedians say new users will find they cannot simply fix things.

    One prolific Wikipedia editor, Jonathan Weiss, told Fox News that "bias on Wikipedia somewhat reflects the bias in academia and journalism. It’s easier to find an open Marxist rather than a center-right conservative," he said.

    Weiss mentioned one Wikipedia "administrator" as an example. Administrators are a select group of people who make final calls about what goes on pages. One has a photo of Soviet dictator Vladimir Lenin on their profile paired with a Lenin quote about how even "The most democratic bourgeois republics" are "organs of class oppression."

    Weiss is in the top 100 Wikipedia editors by contributions, having made more than 415,142 edits on the site since 2006, mostly on sports-related pages.

    But he said that the political pages have largely been taken over by editors with a political axe to grind.

    KAMALA HARRIS' WIKIPEDIA PAGE SCRUBBED, IGNITING ONLINE FIGHT

    "If you’re the only one who’s not a Marxist on a page, you’re going to lose," he said. "It can quickly be disheartening."

    The talk pages show that various users attempted to add balance to the socialism and communism pages. In 2020, for example, longtime Wikipedia volunteer "Narssarssuaq" added a mention to the communism page about the atrocities committed, sourced to a Harvard University Press publication, but the edit was quickly erased by other editors.

    "Communism didn't kill these people; Stalin did," one user argued. "I’ve always been bothered by the concept that famines are caused by communism."

    The user, "Narssarssuaq" later quit Wikipedia (not necessarily over the communism page).

    "Right now my conscience does not allow me to contribute to this project, not even with attempts to provide balance to biased articles," he wrote in a goodbye message.

    "The era of Wikipedia… is over," he said.

    Encyclopedia Britannica provides one alternative. A study by Harvard researchers published in a peer-reviewed journal concluded that, "we find that Wikipedia articles are more slanted towards Democratic views than are Britannica articles, as well as more biased."

    Asked for comment about the study, a Wikimedia spokesperson noted that the study also "shows how the more people edit an article, the more neutral it becomes." She also pointed to another study that found that page quality is higher when editors are more politically diverse, and lower when they think alike.

    Weiss said the only hope for Wikipedia achieving more balance is if many more non-leftist editors join Wikipedia. But it can feel like a futile effort, as new editors find themselves outnumbered on political pages, with edits for balance deleted. Weiss suggested that new editors cut their teeth on non-political pages.

    Wikipedia co-founder Larry Sanger says that the deck is too stacked on Wikipedia for it to ever be salvaged, and he is now working on a protocol called "Encyclosphere" to facilitate other encyclopedias.

    Asked about whether the site was too far gone to fix, Weiss said he had hope.

    "I’m a person who’s already dropped 10,000 hours of my life on Wikipedia, but it is disheartening," Weiss said.

    "But I think it’s in theory salvageable. I’m not giving up yet," he said.


    Source

    © Copyright Original Source



    Pretty much from its inception Wikipedia was accused of leaning to the left, although one study from 2012 found that the level of bias had diminished by that time: Is Wikipedia Biased? but now it appears to be back with a vengeance.


    I'm always still in trouble again

    "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
    "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

  • #2
    But we have Snopes to fact check Wikipedia, and Snopes is completely unbiased, right?

    RIGHT?
    "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

    Comment


    • #3
      The online community tends toward being young and techy people and they tend to lean left, so you'd expect an encyclopedia edited by the online community to reflect the general views of its editors.

      The two main pages for "Socialism" and "Communism" which the OP article has a long cry about are nearly all theoretical discussions of the many different varieties of socialism and communism, not a discussion of outcomes or history.

      Wikipedia has other articles titled...
      Mass killings under communist regimes
      List of massacres in the Soviet Union
      Excess mortality in the Soviet Union under Joseph Stalin
      ...so it's not like it avoids the topic.

      I don't know whether I'd agree or not with the OP article's psychological obsession that discussion of deaths under communist regimes should be included in articles about the theories and types of socialism and capitalism or not - in an article about Capitalism would you expect a discussion of genocides or mass deaths or slavery in capitalist nations or a list of everything capitalist countries and governments have ever done wrong?

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Starlight View Post
        The online community tends toward being young and techy people and they tend to lean left, so you'd expect an encyclopedia edited by the online community to reflect the general views of its editors.

        The two main pages for "Socialism" and "Communism" which the OP article has a long cry about are nearly all theoretical discussions of the many different varieties of socialism and communism, not a discussion of outcomes or history.

        Wikipedia has other articles titled...
        Mass killings under communist regimes
        List of massacres in the Soviet Union
        Excess mortality in the Soviet Union under Joseph Stalin
        ...so it's not like it avoids the topic.

        I don't know whether I'd agree or not with the OP article's psychological obsession that discussion of deaths under communist regimes should be included in articles about the theories and types of socialism and capitalism or not - in an article about Capitalism would you expect a discussion of genocides or mass deaths or slavery in capitalist nations or a list of everything capitalist countries and governments have ever done wrong?
        So you acknowledge that it slants to the left and then proceed to try to show it really doesn't.

        The genocides that took place by the left were an integral part of their implementing their policies such as the Great Leap Forward and Cultural Revolution in China, the Holdomor in the Ukraine, the Great Purge and Decossackization in the Soviet Union, and the Killing Fields of Cambodia. Without them those regimes would not have been able to maintain control. To exclude them from general discussions on various regimes and countries makes no sense. It would be like separating any discussion about the Nazis from an article about Germany during the 20th century.

        And slavery is hardly something unique to Capitalism as we can see what is going on today in Western China.

        Btw, considering that you consider Stalin to have been a right-winger it is interesting to see you list Excess mortality in the Soviet Union under Joseph Stalin among atrocities committed by the left
        Last edited by rogue06; 02-22-2021, 08:10 AM.

        I'm always still in trouble again

        "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
        "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Starlight View Post
          The online community tends toward being young and techy people and they tend to lean left, so you'd expect an encyclopedia edited by the online community to reflect the general views of its editors.

          The two main pages for "Socialism" and "Communism" which the OP article has a long cry about are nearly all theoretical discussions of the many different varieties of socialism and communism, not a discussion of outcomes or history.

          Wikipedia has other articles titled...
          Mass killings under communist regimes
          List of massacres in the Soviet Union
          Excess mortality in the Soviet Union under Joseph Stalin
          ...so it's not like it avoids the topic.

          I don't know whether I'd agree or not with the OP article's psychological obsession that discussion of deaths under communist regimes should be included in articles about the theories and types of socialism and capitalism or not - in an article about Capitalism would you expect a discussion of genocides or mass deaths or slavery in capitalist nations or a list of everything capitalist countries and governments have ever done wrong?
          It would seem that an intellectually honest treatment of any philosophy or governmental system should include both the pluses and minuses of such a system.
          I'm perfectly OK, for example, with a treatment of capitalism in the US to include the horror of slavery - it's a lesson from which we should learn and never do again.
          "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

            It would seem that an intellectually honest treatment of any philosophy or governmental system should include both the pluses and minuses of such a system.
            I'm perfectly OK, for example, with a treatment of capitalism in the US to include the horror of slavery - it's a lesson from which we should learn and never do again.
            America's history of slavery is the other example that I had in mind when I cited the Nazis and Germany. Neither are left out of basic articles on the subjects of the U.S. and Germany, forcing those interested to look up specific separate articles. And that's the way it should be.

            I'm always still in trouble again

            "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
            "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
              America's history of slavery is the other example that I had in mind when I cited the Nazis and Germany. Neither are left out of basic articles on the subjects of the U.S. and Germany, forcing those interested to look up specific separate articles. And that's the way it should be.
              It just makes sense to show the benefits and abuses. Just about any system I can think of can be abused in one way or another, because they're run by people.
              "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

              Comment


              • #8
                No surprise. Far from being the promised Information Superhighway, the Internet has turned into the Disinformation Superhighway and yet another advertising channel. In some places, its turned into a way to control the population. So I'm not surprised to learn that Wikipedia is yet another place where individuals are post their truth instead of the truth or the whole story.
                "For I desire mercy, not sacrifice, and acknowledgment of God rather than burnt offerings." Hosea 6:6

                "Theology can be an intellectual entertainment." Metropolitan Anthony Bloom

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Starlight View Post

                  I don't know whether I'd agree or not with the OP article's psychological obsession that discussion of deaths under communist regimes should be included in articles about the theories and types of socialism and capitalism or not - in an article about Capitalism would you expect a discussion of genocides or mass deaths or slavery in capitalist nations or a list of everything capitalist countries and governments have ever done wrong?
                  Slavery would be more appropriate historically under Colonialism and Mercantilism.

                  Genocide and mass death are usually brought up in the historical development of the Americas by Europeans. The genocide that tend to be hushed up are the ones committed by the Young Turks.

                  The atrocities of the Congo Free State would naturally be brought up under the time period of Imperialism and the Scramble for Africa.
                  Ideological Vagrant (Yes, this is in Comic Sans.)

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Wikipedia has been strongly liberally biased for at least a decade. I'm surprised people are just figuring it out now. It's okay for getting a brief overview of technical topics, or finding out what year a band released an album, but it is wholly worthless for any topic that is slightly political or religious in nature since such articles tend to be nothing more than outlets for liberal propaganda.
                    Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                    But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                    Than a fool in the eyes of God


                    From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                      Wikipedia has been strongly liberally biased for at least a decade. I'm surprised people are just figuring it out now. It's okay for getting a brief overview of technical topics, or finding out what year a band released an album, but it is wholly worthless for any topic that is slightly political or religious in nature since such articles tend to be nothing more than outlets for liberal propaganda.
                      Yeah to me it's always been somewhat of a joke when someone uses it as a source.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Sparko View Post

                        Yeah to me it's always been somewhat of a joke when someone uses it as a source.
                        It's good place, however, to start, because it can trigger stuff to look up elsewhere.
                        "Neighbor, how long has it been since you’ve had a big, thick, steaming bowl of Wolf Brand Chili?”

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                          Wikipedia has been strongly liberally biased for at least a decade. I'm surprised people are just figuring it out now. It's okay for getting a brief overview of technical topics, or finding out what year a band released an album, but it is wholly worthless for any topic that is slightly political or religious in nature since such articles tend to be nothing more than outlets for liberal propaganda.
                          This is far more than just having a liberal slant. It is whitewashing and trying to conceal things in an obvious manner.

                          It probably is making the MSM green with envy.

                          I'm always still in trouble again

                          "You're by far the worst poster on TWeb" and "TWeb's biggest liar" --starlight (the guy who says Stalin was a right-winger)
                          "Of course, human life begins at fertilization that’s not the argument." --Tassman

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                            This is far more than just having a liberal slant. It is whitewashing and trying to conceal things in an obvious manner.

                            It probably is making the MSM green with envy.
                            Well, yeah, but this is business as usual for Wikipedia. Has been for a very long time. I don't know why people are acting like this is a new development.

                            Wikipedia was an interesting but failed social experiment. The hypothesis that only those who were knowledgeable in a subject would edit pages, and everybody else would exercise restraint seemed to ignore human nature.
                            Some may call me foolish, and some may call me odd
                            But I'd rather be a fool in the eyes of man
                            Than a fool in the eyes of God


                            From "Fools Gold" by Petra

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              You can't establish bias by only looking at treatment of one side. The OP complains about the articles on communism and socialism not mentioning various atrocities by Russia, China and others. It doesn't say whether the articles on e.g. republicanism, totalitarianism etc do mention atrocities. If they don't - and a quick look suggests they don't* - there's no bias and no discrimination, just a somewhat odd policy, and the author of the article is merely showing his own bias.

                              *The page on Nazism does, but that one is possibly more germane than the others since genocide was central to the ideology.
                              Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

                              mikewhitney: What if the speed of light changed when light is passing through water? ... I have 3 semesters of college Physics.

                              Mountain Man: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
                              Mountain Man: … this is how liberals argue these days, with labels instead of ideas.

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