Handsy Joe cancels Keystone

[mossrose]

They aren't "tar sands", you moron! And you just shut down 2000 jobs! You keep getting your oil from the Middle East, then, where human rights are virtually non-existent! You are SO stupid that you don't know that Alberta oil is the cleanest environmentally on the planet! But you keep listening to the other liars who lie about the OIL SANDS!

And our jackass PM is only "disappointed"? After he said yesterday and today that he would talk to Joe about it and make Joe see the light? Trudeau and Biden are both liars!



https://globalnews.ca/news/7588853/b...s-keystone-xl/

Hours after he was sworn into office, U.S. President Joe Biden has signed an executive order to revoke the permit that would allow the Keystone XL pipeline expansion project to continue.

The project which was previously approved by TC Energy would see the 1,930-kilometre pipeline transport up to 830,000 barrels of oil a day from Alberta to Nebraska.

The project was expected to cost US$8 billion.

The expansion was green-lit by former U.S. president Donald Trump in January of last year.


However, Biden had long promised to rescind the presidential permit in keeping with his campaign promise to shift the U.S. from fossil fuels and towards clean energy.

Speaking to CNBC last year, Biden said the pipeline “is tar sands that we don’t need — that in fact (are a) very, very high pollutant.”

Biden said claims that shutting down the Keystone pipeline would do undue damage to the oil industry are “just not rational,” adding that the arguments do not make any environmental or economic sense.

In a statement Wednesday evening, Trudeau said the move was disappointing.

“”While we welcome the President’s commitment to fight climate change, we are disappointed but acknowledge the President’s decision to fulfill his election campaign promise on Keystone XL,” he said.

Trudeau said he spoke with Biden about the project last November, adding that Canada’s Ambassador to the U.S., Kirsten Hillman and others “made the case to high-level officials in the incoming administration.”

Edit to add: If you bring Trump up in this thread you will be asked to leave.

[whag]

They aren't "tar sands", you moron!

They also didn't appear fully formed 6,000 years ago:

Alberta’s oil sands were formed millions of years ago, as tiny marine creatures died and drifted to the sea floor and were covered by layers of sediment that exerted enough pressure and temperatures to transform the organic matter into oil.

Over millions of years, that oil became trapped in thick layers of sand. Gradually, lighter hydrocarbons evaporated or were consumed by bacteria, leaving bitumen and water trapped in the sand. The area was then covered by glacial debris, but oil sands outcrops along the Athabasca River showed where deposits lay buried.

https://www.capp.ca/oil/history-of-oil/

[rogue06]

They aren't "tar sands", you moron! And you just shut down 2000 jobs! You keep getting your oil from the Middle East, then, where human rights are virtually non-existent! You are SO stupid that you don't know that Alberta oil is the cleanest environmentally on the planet! But you keep listening to the other liars who lie about the OIL SANDS!

And our jackass PM is only "disappointed"? After he said yesterday and today that he would talk to Joe about it and make Joe see the light? Trudeau and Biden are both liars!



https://globalnews.ca/news/7588853/b...s-keystone-xl/

Hours after he was sworn into office, U.S. President Joe Biden has signed an executive order to revoke the permit that would allow the Keystone XL pipeline expansion project to continue.

The project which was previously approved by TC Energy would see the 1,930-kilometre pipeline transport up to 830,000 barrels of oil a day from Alberta to Nebraska.

The project was expected to cost US$8 billion.

The expansion was green-lit by former U.S. president Donald Trump in January of last year.


However, Biden had long promised to rescind the presidential permit in keeping with his campaign promise to shift the U.S. from fossil fuels and towards clean energy.

Speaking to CNBC last year, Biden said the pipeline “is tar sands that we don’t need — that in fact (are a) very, very high pollutant.”

Biden said claims that shutting down the Keystone pipeline would do undue damage to the oil industry are “just not rational,” adding that the arguments do not make any environmental or economic sense.

In a statement Wednesday evening, Trudeau said the move was disappointing.

“”While we welcome the President’s commitment to fight climate change, we are disappointed but acknowledge the President’s decision to fulfill his election campaign promise on Keystone XL,” he said.

Trudeau said he spoke with Biden about the project last November, adding that Canada’s Ambassador to the U.S., Kirsten Hillman and others “made the case to high-level officials in the incoming administration.”

Has anyone let old Joe that he cancelled it yet?

[mossrose]

They also didn't appear fully formed 6,000 years ago:



https://www.capp.ca/oil/history-of-oil/

What's your point?

[whag]

What's your point?

You called Biden a "moron" for calling it tar sands. Petroleum is a geologically ancient substance that you believe was created in its current form ~6,000 ya. Geology has confirmed its ancient origin dating back to the carboniferous period in earth's history ~300 mya.

Here's how oil is extracted from sand (bold mine):

"In its natural state, bitumen is typically mixed with “oil sands” or “tar sands,” which makes it extremely difficult to extract and an unconventional source of oil. Only about 20% of the world’s reserves of bitumen are above ground and can be surface mined.

Unfortunately, because bitumen contains high amounts of sulfur and heavy metals, extracting and refining it is both costly and harmful to the environment. Producing bitumen into useful products releases 12% more carbon emissions than processing conventional oil.

Bitumen is about the consistency of cold molasses, and powerful hot steam has to be pumped into the well in order to melt the bitumen to extract it. Large quantities of water are then used to separate the bitumen from sand and clay. This process depletes nearby water supplies. Releasing the treated water back into the environment can further contaminate the remaining water supply."

[mossrose]

You called Biden a "moron" for calling it tar sands. Petroleum is a geologically ancient substance that you believe was created in its current form ~6,000 ya. Geology has confirmed its ancient origin dating back to the carboniferous period in earth's history ~300 mya.

Here's how oil is extracted from sand (bold mine):

"In its natural state, bitumen is typically mixed with “oil sands” or “tar sands,” which makes it extremely difficult to extract and an unconventional source of oil. Only about 20% of the world’s reserves of bitumen are above ground and can be surface mined.

Unfortunately, because bitumen contains high amounts of sulfur and heavy metals, extracting and refining it is both costly and harmful to the environment. Producing bitumen into useful products releases 12% more carbon emissions than processing conventional oil.

Bitumen is about the consistency of cold molasses, and powerful hot steam has to be pumped into the well in order to melt the bitumen to extract it. Large quantities of water are then used to separate the bitumen from sand and clay. This process depletes nearby water supplies. Releasing the treated water back into the environment can further contaminate the remaining water supply."

You are off topic. My belief in God and creation has absolutely nothing to do with Biden putting thousands of people out of work with the stroke of a pen. If you want to discuss Creation you can do so in another thread.

[whag]

You are off topic. My belief in God and creation has absolutely nothing to do with Biden putting thousands of people out of work with the stroke of a pen. If you want to discuss Creation you can do so in another thread.

Fair enough, but you said "handsy" and "moron." It's not like there aren't environmental and tribal sovereignty arguments involved:

Keystone Pipeline leaks 383,000 gallons of oil in second big spill in two years

“With each one of these major spills that happens on the Keystone pipeline system, it becomes clearer and clearer that this is not safe,” said Doug Hayes, an attorney leading the Sierra Club’s work on Keystone XL. Critics worry about a similar mishap contaminating one of the hundreds of waterways along Keystone XL’s expected path, he said.

Tribes make new move to shut down Dakota Access Pipeline:

“The Tribes are irreparably harmed by the ongoing operation of the pipeline, through the exposure to catastrophic risk, through the ongoing trauma of the government’s refusal to comply with the law, and through undermining the Tribes’ sovereign governmental role to protect their members and respond to potential disasters,” attorneys Jan Hasselman and Nicole Ducheneaux wrote in a Friday filing.

Tribes fear a spill into the Missouri River just north of the Standing Rock Reservation would pollute their water supply. Pipeline operator Energy Transfer and the Army Corps of Engineers both maintain the pipeline is safe. Prolonged protests in 2016 and 2017 drew thousands of people to camps near the river crossing and resulted in hundreds of arrests.

And this part was on-topic:

"In its natural state, bitumen is typically mixed with “oil sands” or “tar sands,” which makes it extremely difficult to extract and an unconventional source of oil. Only about 20% of the world’s reserves of bitumen are above ground and can be surface mined.

Unfortunately, because bitumen contains high amounts of sulfur and heavy metals, extracting and refining it is both costly and harmful to the environment. Producing bitumen into useful products releases 12% more carbon emissions than processing conventional oil.

Bitumen is about the consistency of cold molasses, and powerful hot steam has to be pumped into the well in order to melt the bitumen to extract it. Large quantities of water are then used to separate the bitumen from sand and clay. This process depletes nearby water supplies. Releasing the treated water back into the environment can further contaminate the remaining water supply."

[mossrose]

Fair enough, but you said "handsy" and "moron." It's not like there aren't environmental and tribal sovereignty arguments involved:

Keystone Pipeline leaks 383,000 gallons of oil in second big spill in two years



Tribes make new move to shut down Dakota Access Pipeline:



And this part was on-topic:

"In its natural state, bitumen is typically mixed with “oil sands” or “tar sands,” which makes it extremely difficult to extract and an unconventional source of oil. Only about 20% of the world’s reserves of bitumen are above ground and can be surface mined.

Unfortunately, because bitumen contains high amounts of sulfur and heavy metals, extracting and refining it is both costly and harmful to the environment. Producing bitumen into useful products releases 12% more carbon emissions than processing conventional oil.

Bitumen is about the consistency of cold molasses, and powerful hot steam has to be pumped into the well in order to melt the bitumen to extract it. Large quantities of water are then used to separate the bitumen from sand and clay. This process depletes nearby water supplies. Releasing the treated water back into the environment can further contaminate the remaining water supply."

This thread is also not about the mythology surrounding the oil sands.

I am talking about the loss of jobs for thousands of people on both sides of the border. If you insist on perpetrating myths in this thread you can get out.

[whag]

This thread is also not about the mythology surrounding the oil sands.

I am talking about the loss of jobs for thousands of people on both sides of the border. If you insist on perpetrating myths in this thread you can get out.

“Mythology” meaning?

The context of this issue is relevant. There are arguments made by indigenous people, environmentalists, geologists and other scientists on this issue. It is not just an economic issue but one that involves risk on both sides.

I’m working on a project that relates to tribal sovereignty and water justice, so I’m aware of the complexities of this.

[Stoic]

They aren't "tar sands", you moron!

What makes you think that they aren't tar sands?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athaba...ort%20McMurray.

[mossrose]

“Mythology” meaning?

The context of this issue is relevant. There are arguments made by indigenous people, environmentalists, geologists and other scientists on this issue. It is not just an economic issue but one that involves risk on both sides.

I’m working on a project that relates to tribal sovereignty and water justice, so I’m aware of the complexities of this.

If you are talking about the pipeline, I know there are issues with indigenous people in the States, and really very few environmental issues except those brought up by indigenous people and enviro-nuts. Many of those issues have been answered over the more than a decade this debate has been raging. Or maybe you need to discuss, in another thread, the horrendous mess made by these same indigenous people and their enviro-nut friends a few years ago during a "protest" against the pipeline. Talk about damage to the environment!

But you aren't talking about the pipeline. You are talking about the oil sands. So your argument is moot. This thread isn't about the oil sands, aside from the misnaming of them by those who want to smear them.

This is the third time I've told you that you are off topic. If you do it again,you will be asked to leave the thread.

[mossrose]

What makes you think that they aren't tar sands?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athaba...ort%20McMurray.

The oil sands, or, better yet, the Athabaska oil sands, are mislabeled "tar sands" by people who want to defame them. This thread is not about them, except that I commented on Joe's likewise misuse of the term.

I see nobody wants to address the loss of thousands of livelihoods on both sides of the border. And I guess the US is content to continue to purchase their oil from the Midfle East and South America instead.

A shame. I hope those folk can find other work. Not likely in this climate of covid and enviro-fear.

[Ronson]

They aren't "tar sands", you moron! And you just shut down 2000 jobs! You keep getting your oil from the Middle East, then, where human rights are virtually non-existent! You are SO stupid that you don't know that Alberta oil is the cleanest environmentally on the planet! But you keep listening to the other liars who lie about the OIL SANDS!

And our jackass PM is only "disappointed"? After he said yesterday and today that he would talk to Joe about it and make Joe see the light? Trudeau and Biden are both liars!

I expect all sorts of confusing and contrary policies from Biden, as President Demento appeases unknown powerbrokers hiding in the shadows. I am preparing for a bumpy ride.

[Cow Poke]

I really don't get this name calling thing. Yeah, I've called him Sleep Joe, but he's POTUS now, and as much as we don't like it, he WILL be for at least a few more months.

We risk being accused of Biden Derangement Syndrome.

God is still on His throne, and it is HE to whom we look for the future.

[mossrose]

I really don't get this name calling thing. Yeah, I've called him Sleep Joe, but he's POTUS now, and as much as we don't like it, he WILL be for at least a few more months.

We risk being accused of Biden Derangement Syndrome.

God is still on His throne, and it is HE to whom we look for the future.

My apologies. I will attempt to refrain from such contempt in the future.