Biden and the 25th Amendment

[Starlight]

I think there's a significant difference between Biden and Trump. Trump was conscious but insane, and so actively issued stupid orders to staff, to the point where his senior staff were vetoing his orders and talking about using the 25th amendment on him. By contrast Biden is mostly sane when he's conscious, but I can foresee him sleeping on the job a fair bit (and more and more), but that's not going to cause him to actively issue stupid orders.

Those are two quite different motivations for thinking about using the 25th amendment. The country can probably cope fine with a president who does nothing (after all, Reagan mostly watched TV, and Trump mostly golfed and watched Fox, so it's been done before), it's when a President starts trying to do stuff, but crazy stuff, that it would become a serious problem. I don't see that happening from Biden. His administration is vastly, vastly more in danger of being a snooze-fest policy-wise of boring policies we've seen before, than it is likely to involve him issuing crazy new orders.

[Mountain Man]

Congress wouldn't pick the VP. Harris would. But Congress would have to approve it.

Yeah, I know, but since she has to pick someone she knows Congress will approve then it's essentially their pick.

[rogue06]

Yeah, I know, but since she has to pick someone she knows Congress will approve then it's essentially their pick.

Meh. That's like saying they pick the SCOTUS appointments because they have to approve them.

[Ronson]

That didn't make him illegitimate. Ford became president in accordance with the procedures laid out in the constitution.

Chosen (not elected) by a man who later resigned due to corruption. Illegitimate, as far as I'm concerned.

But hey, many on the Left want to throw out the Constitution anyway.

A claim like that begs for some evidence.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/er...ominion-trump/

graph.jpg

[Starlight]

Ronson, as you've been told before, the surge in your line was Milwaukee county reporting its absentee results. Milwaukee is is a Dem-leaning county, the biggest county in Wisconsin, and Dems tended to vote by mail more than Republicans did, and they reported the vote totals from that county in one go.

All the reporters and commentators knew that that batch of votes was potentially going to make a difference to the outcome, so media held off calling the state despite Trump's lead, and the media was there at 4am to film the Milwaukee county's election official taking those absentee vote count totals to the courthouse under police escort. Everyone know this was the big batch of votes that was coming in all at once, and everyone knew it would skew heavily democratic, so everyone was waiting to see if that large batch of dem-leaning votes would be enough to push Biden past Trump in the state. It was, just.

As FiveThirtyEight notes, not all of these votes went to Biden:

“These batches were NOT 100% Biden votes; behind the blue line, there is also a red line representing the thousands of votes Trump gained. There are also counter examples, where Trump’s line shoots up suddenly when a favorable batch of results are reported.”

FiveThirtyEight also points out that there were many states in which the lead changed throughout the counting:

States.jpg

I note there are several vertical lines in those graphs where counts from large blocks of votes are added simultaneously.

[Mountain Man]

Meh. That's like saying they pick the SCOTUS appointments because they have to approve them.

Well, yes, the president starts the process, but Congress can force his hand to a degree by refusing to confirm. It's all part of the system of checks and balances.

[Ronson]

Starlight, yes, I am well aware of the claims made by Democrat vote counters hidden behind closed doors. Thanks for reiterating it.

[Starlight]

Starlight, yes, I am well aware of the claims made by Democrat vote counters hidden behind closed doors. Thanks for reiterating it.

What about the claims is "behind closed doors"?

I watched it happen. I was watching the counts for Wisconsin creep up, and following the commentators. Different sources were all in agreement that the Wisconsin was going to come down to the absentee ballot counts in the biggest Dem county, and everyone was aware those hadn't been reported yet and were waiting for those numbers to be reported. Then they were reported. It was expected to happen, then it happened.

Your obsession with an expected event happening as being proof of foul play is nuts.

[Ronson]

What about the claims is "behind closed doors"?

That's where they did/do the "counting." Unobserved.

I watched it happen. I was watching the counts for Wisconsin creep up, and following the commentators. Different sources were all in agreement that the Wisconsin was going to come down to the absentee ballot counts in the biggest Dem county, and everyone was aware those hadn't been reported yet and were waiting for those numbers to be reported. Then they were reported. It was expected to happen, then it happened.

Your obsession with an expected event happening as being proof of foul play is nuts.

The 11th presidential election that I've watched. Unprecedented irregularities that defy logical explanation. Mail-in ballots being counted by Democrats outside the view of Republicans. Voting machines that have been denounced by Republicans and Democrats - for years.

Biden is an illegitimate president.

[Starlight]

That's where they did/do the "counting." Unobserved.

All vote counting in every election happens outside the direct view of the public. But parties send representatives to observe the counting processes.

Republican representatives were there observing the counting processes. That's why Trump keeps losing court cases, because his lawyers keep having to admit that, yes, they had observers in place observing the counts.

Unprecedented irregularities

False. This election was pretty much irregularity-free. It was a lot better in that regard than any other US election in recent history.

that defy logical explanation.

False. The things the crazies have been complaining about have really basic explanations. e.g. your obsession with the count from a big bunch of votes being reported.

To Mail-in ballots being counted by Democrats outside the view of Republicans.

False. The Republicans had observers in place.

Your posts are at the point of becoming too stupid for me to bother with. Every part of what you said above false. What is wrong with you?

Voting machines that have been denounced by Republicans and Democrats - for years.

I'll grant you that all electronic voting machines should be thrown out and paper ballots used.

Biden is an illegitimate president.

[Ronson]

All vote counting in every election happens outside the direct view of the public. But parties send representatives to observe the counting processes.

Republican representatives were there observing the counting processes. That's why Trump keeps losing court cases, because his lawyers keep having to admit that, yes, they had observers in place observing the counts.

Too far away to see anything.

False. This election was pretty much irregularity-free. It was a lot better in that regard than any other US election in recent history.

False. I believe my eyes.

False. The things the crazies have been complaining about have really basic explanations. e.g. your obsession with the count from a big bunch of votes being reported.

False. The Republicans had observers in place.

Your posts are at the point of becoming too stupid for me to bother with.

Then don't. I hate to use the trendy term, but this would be a perfect example of "gaslighting."

For me to believe you or these lousy explanations would require me to reassess my history of watching elections. It ain't happening.

Every part of what you said above false. What is wrong with you?

I'll grant you that all electronic voting machines should be thrown out and paper ballots used.

I'll bet you wouldn't want this garbage Dominion used in your country.

[Starlight]

Too far away to see anything.

False. I believe my eyes.

Then don't. I hate to use the trendy term, but this would be a perfect example of "gaslighting."

For me to believe you or these lousy explanations would require me to reassess my history of watching elections. It ain't happening.

Okay I'll put you down as full nutbar.

I'll bet you wouldn't want this garbage Dominion used in your country.

Because it was invented by Hugo Chavez in conjunction with the CIA in order to spread Communism around the world, and used by Republican officials in Georgia to ensure a Biden victory? Can I upgrade you from full nutbar to special-edition Sidney Powell supersized nutbar?

My country uses paper ballots and counts by hand, and I'm pleased with that system and hope it remains that way, because as someone with a background in computer programming I wouldn't trust any kind of electronic voting system.

[Juvenal]

Okay I'll put you down as full nutbar.

Because it was invented by Hugo Chavez in conjunction with the CIA in order to spread Communism around the world, and used by Republican officials in Georgia to ensure a Biden victory? Can I upgrade you from full nutbar to special-edition Sidney Powell supersized nutbar?

My country uses paper ballots and counts by hand, and I'm pleased with that system and hope it remains that way, because as someone with a background in computer programming I wouldn't trust any kind of electronic voting system.

Ronson prefers to get his misinformation directly from Russia Today because their Russian agitprop is openly acknowledged. If it weren't for his familiarity with definite and indefinite articles, I'd be less than convinced he's an American.

[Starlight]

Ronson prefers to get his misinformation directly from Russia Today because their Russian agitprop is openly acknowledged. If it weren't for his familiarity with definite and indefinite articles, I'd be less than convinced he's an American.

His list of imagined Trump-achievements in another thread was both quite bizarre and very Russia-related. He obviously follows nonconventional news sources and has a particular interest in Russia.

[Ronson]

Okay I'll put you down as full nutbar.

Because it was invented by Hugo Chavez in conjunction with the CIA in order to spread Communism around the world, and used by Republican officials in Georgia to ensure a Biden victory? Can I upgrade you from full nutbar to special-edition Sidney Powell supersized nutbar?

My country uses paper ballots and counts by hand, and I'm pleased with that system and hope it remains that way, because as someone with a background in computer programming I wouldn't trust any kind of electronic voting system.

You don't trust Dominion? I'll have to put you down as a nutbar.