Originally posted by jordanriver
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A "junk DNA" discussion
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Originally posted by jordanriver View PostI'll try.
look,
If you're Darwinist, isn't all DNA remnants of evolutionary progression.
wouldn't it all be junk that ended up with surprise function
That being said, please give the answer that you promised with "I'll try." All you did was make an idiotic wisecrack.
K54
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Originally posted by phank View PostAn interesting way of looking at it, but probably pretty much true, since all functions were novel at one time. But you would have to regard any beneficial mutation as "junk-by-default" first, and THEN notice that it's not so useless after all.
So JR's (non-)answer would imply the opposite default of what anti-evolutionists claim (there is no "junk".) Now everything is "junk" until proven otherwise.
I wonder what Jorge thinks of her/his answer?
K54
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Originally posted by klaus54 View PostAren't you the one who agreed that there's no micro/macro boundary? I.e., that there's no genetic barrier to evolutionary theory (why you use scare quotes on "Darwinism" -- which is only one aspect of the modern theory - is beyond comprehension.)
That being said, please give the answer that you promised with "I'll try." All you did was make an idiotic wisecrack.
K54
what we're the "scare" quotesTo say that crony capitalism is not true/free market capitalism, is like saying a grand slam is not true baseball, or like saying scoring a touchdown is not true American football ...Stefan Mykhaylo D
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Originally posted by klaus54 View PostZing!
So JR's (non-)answer would imply the opposite default of what anti-evolutionists claim (there is no "junk".) Now everything is "junk" until proven otherwise.
I wonder what Jorge thinks of her/his answer?
K54
if all is junk
then none of it junk, just raw materialTo say that crony capitalism is not true/free market capitalism, is like saying a grand slam is not true baseball, or like saying scoring a touchdown is not true American football ...Stefan Mykhaylo D
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Originally posted by jordanriver View PostOK
what we're the "scare" quotes
And strange since you apparently don't have a scientific problem with macroevolution.
So what's yer 'splanation for that there "junk" DNA?
K54
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Originally posted by klaus54 View Post"Darwinism" as a pitiful attempt at sarcastic jab at modern evolutionary theory.
And strange since you apparently don't have a scientific problem with macroevolution.
So what's yer 'splanation for that there "junk" DNA?
K54
saying "Darwinism" is a scare quote?
Darwinism, i.e. methodological naturalism, not just evolution, but evolution with no intelligent agent or supernatural assistance.
what is wrong with distinguishing 'Darwinism' , from whatever term would be for creationism (creation of multiple kinds , whatever those original types were ...don't ask me ..I dunno) , followed by speciation/variety
I don't see anything scary about that.To say that crony capitalism is not true/free market capitalism, is like saying a grand slam is not true baseball, or like saying scoring a touchdown is not true American football ...Stefan Mykhaylo D
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Originally posted by jordanriver View PostI'll try.
look,
If you're Darwinist, isn't all DNA remnants of evolutionary progression.
wouldn't it all be junk that ended up with surprise function
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Originally posted by Roy View PostBut they do have a problem with that. AiG and ICR spent years rejecting the idea that extra-solar planets would be found. You only have to look at the articles they published in the 1990s, before we had telescopes like Kepler (e.g. this and this). Since the evidence for extra-solar planets became overwhelming, they have instead switched to saying that no Earth-like planets will be found (e.g. here), with equally little justification.
Roy
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Originally posted by sfs1 View PostYes.
Not really. Some of it likely inherits function from genetic material that predates the existence of DNA, and probably life itself.
you are talking about non-carbon based lifeforms?
I didn't know they had function.To say that crony capitalism is not true/free market capitalism, is like saying a grand slam is not true baseball, or like saying scoring a touchdown is not true American football ...Stefan Mykhaylo D
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Originally posted by jordanriver View Post??????
saying "Darwinism" is a scare quote?
Darwinism, i.e. methodological naturalism, not just evolution, but evolution with no intelligent agent or supernatural assistance.
what is wrong with distinguishing 'Darwinism' , from whatever term would be for creationism (creation of multiple kinds , whatever those original types were ...don't ask me ..I dunno) , followed by speciation/variety
I don't see anything scary about that.
Sheesh...
You say evolution has no micro/macro boundary, then you imply you don't accept it, then you write "Darwinism" and "science" (as applied to evolutionary theory) in quotes.
K54
P.S. So I guess you mean that created "kinds" are in fact a boundary to macroevolution -- even though you or any other YEC/Creto/anti-evolutionist have the foggiest notion what that means.
Swell...
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Originally posted by phank View PostAn interesting way of looking at it, but probably pretty much true, since all functions were novel at one time. But you would have to regard any beneficial mutation as "junk-by-default" first, and THEN notice that it's not so useless after all.
Look , I am Creationist, but Creationist who knows we are stuck in NATURAL world for now. and that means entropy
And if Yahweh is going to kick us out of paradise and and make us live here in natural world, I think least He can do is provide occasional failsafe mechanism here and there,
like mechanism stress induced mutagenesis , like SOS response genes for example ,
that way you get not just natural random mutations, but so many that in the mix, if extinction doesn't happen first, at least get survivor.
but my attempt at "junk"
I think junk DNA is like long repetitive repetitive repetitive ...stacks of building bricks on pallets...
to natives coming out of jungle for first time and stumble on civilization, they see fortress built of bricks,
on approach they get fired upon by arrows from where wall appeared to open.
They conclude fortress not natural, like a hill, but a functional object.
later they stumble upon field with stack after stack of bricks on pallets., which they recognize from the fortress.
after fear at first, when no arrows fly out, they realize its just stack of bricks with no function.
they conclude, must just be junk, maybe used to be fortress , but now just useless piles.
I think scientists just recently stumble on DNA "civilization" and came to hasty conclusions at first.
now they are discovering epigenetics for example, and changes without out mutations, just activation of genes that were already on hand.To say that crony capitalism is not true/free market capitalism, is like saying a grand slam is not true baseball, or like saying scoring a touchdown is not true American football ...Stefan Mykhaylo D
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