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Anti-Vaxx 101 Thread

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Roy View Post
    Tell him the Pfizer CEO (i) believes in taking his own vaccine - and if anyone should know about its effectiveness, he should; and (ii) is still alive, having not died of COVID, unlike 6 million other people.
    There's a lot of problems with that. He says he took the vaccine? Could be a publicity/sales stunt and he didn't take it. He was seen taking the vaccine? Could have been a saline jab. He could legitimately take the vaccine knowing that the risks were low enough to still make gobs of money by the advertised action.

    "and (ii) is still alive" <- Was he supposed to immediately drop dead after the jab?

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by Stoic View Post

      That's certainly up to you. I'd just point out that it would be a mistake to assume that because previous infections were not serious, that future infections won't be serious either.

      https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/2022...s-health-risks
      That report assumes unknown internal damage occurred during previous infections.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by Ronson View Post
        That report assumes unknown internal damage occurred during previous infections.
        It gives that as one possible explanation for the fact that later infections were more serious than earlier infections.

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Ronson View Post

          Well, when I got childhood vaccines they basically protected me from those illnesses. That's what a vaccine should do. I never caught chicken pox, measles, polio, small pox (etc.) and I credit the vaccines to that (in part).

          Pfizer in August 2020, and caught covid again in January 2021. The second time lasted longer than the first, although maybe slightly less intense. If there is no appreciable effect from a vaccine then it could have been a placebo, for all I know. Because of my age, I decided it was worth the gamble to get vaccinated, but I recommended to my family that anyone under 40 should not get it. Probably under 50 even. They have several decades of life yet to go and any long-term side effects from the vaccine may not be known until 2050 or so.
          The purpose of vaccines is not necessarily protect everyone against infection. Virus mutate differently in response vaccines and the development of natural immunity. A good example is the history of Flu vaccines, Getting a flu shot , like a Covid-19 shot or booster, does not necessarily prevent you from getting infected. The vaccines greatly reduce the likelyhood and severity of getting infected. This is due to the virus's nature and ability to mutate and adapt to vaccines over time.

          t is well documented that the Covid-19 vaccines has been very effective in preventing and reducing the severity of the infection.
          Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
          Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
          But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

          go with the flow the river knows . . .

          Frank

          I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

          Comment


          • #20
            I'm not going to through every one of these examples, but I picked one at random, just to show how utterly unreliable your sources are.

            Originally posted by NorrinRadd View Post
            Ok, jab-o-philes, proceed with your debunkification:

            The first real evidence mRNA shots RAISE the risk of Covid hospitalization and death over time -- A big Swedish study offers fragmentary but suggestive data

            [box]On Sep. 20, using data covering 9 million people, Swedish researchers published a paper showing mRNA jabs may increase the risk of Omicron infection after three months.

            That finding received attention. But an even more intriguing nugget in the paper has so far gone unnoticed.

            Based on one statistical analysis vaccinated people had a HIGHER risk of death or hospitalization from Covid roughly a year after receiving their second dose. The charts — b and d below — show that vaccine protection against death and hospitalization begins to decline slowly after about five months and then plunges about nine months.
            !
            The graphs he showed? He's right that they're a statistical analysis that shows a drop. But they're positioned right below the actual data, which he does not show. Why not? Because the actual data is completely contrary to his argument. Have a look for yourself:
            Screen Shot 2022-10-10 at 8.42.33 PM.png
            For all measures except infection, the vaccine effectiveness stays well above zero the entire time. Berenson looked at a different graph, one that showed statistical derivative of these curves, and thought that was a measure of effectiveness. It's no wonder he's been called "the pandemic's wrongest man."

            Every single one of your links is to Berenson.
            "Any sufficiently advanced stupidity is indistinguishable from trolling."

            Comment


            • #21
              For people arguing the semantics of what a vaccine is, I'm wondering what you consider what's commonly caused the shingles vaccine. It doesn't prevent you from getting the virus - you're only at risk of shingles if the virus is already in your system. It won't cause your immune system to eliminate the existing virus. It doesn't even consistently eliminate the symptoms of shingles - some people still get rashes. What it does with high efficacy is block the most severe symptoms of shingles.

              And most people, as well as the CDC, consider it a vaccine.
              "Any sufficiently advanced stupidity is indistinguishable from trolling."

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by TheLurch View Post
                For people arguing the semantics of what a vaccine is, I'm wondering what you consider what's commonly caused the shingles vaccine. It doesn't prevent you from getting the virus - you're only at risk of shingles if the virus is already in your system. It won't cause your immune system to eliminate the existing virus. It doesn't even consistently eliminate the symptoms of shingles - some people still get rashes. What it does with high efficacy is block the most severe symptoms of shingles.

                And most people, as well as the CDC, consider it a vaccine.
                Would you say that the driving mechanism behind the covid vaccines is the same as other vaccines?

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by Ronson View Post

                  Would you say that the driving mechanism behind the covid vaccines is the same as other vaccines?
                  Yes. The mechanism behind all vaccines is exposure of the immune system to antigens (typically proteins) found on pathogens.
                  "Any sufficiently advanced stupidity is indistinguishable from trolling."

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Ronson View Post
                    There's a lot of problems with that. He says he took the vaccine? Could be a publicity/sales stunt and he didn't take it.
                    If the Pfizer CEO only says he took the vaccine, then the argument that "the vaccine(s) don't work, since the Pzifer CEO got COVID-19 twice" collapses.

                    "and (ii) is still alive" <- Was he supposed to immediately drop dead after the jab?
                    If your point relies on quote-mining, you should abandon it.

                    Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

                    MM: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
                    MM on covid-19: We're talking about an illness with a better than 99.9% rate of survival.

                    seer: I believe that so called 'compassion' [for starving Palestinian kids] maybe a cover for anti Semitism, ...

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Roy View Post
                      If the Pfizer CEO only says he took the vaccine, then the argument that "the vaccine(s) don't work, since the Pzifer CEO got COVID-19 twice" collapses.

                      If your point relies on quote-mining, you should abandon it.
                      It's not quote mining as I included your comment in the quote box.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Ronson View Post
                        It's not quote mining as I included your comment in the quote box.
                        So it was open-cast quote mining.


                        Jorge: Functional Complex Information is INFORMATION that is complex and functional.

                        MM: First of all, the Bible is a fixed document.
                        MM on covid-19: We're talking about an illness with a better than 99.9% rate of survival.

                        seer: I believe that so called 'compassion' [for starving Palestinian kids] maybe a cover for anti Semitism, ...

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Ronson View Post

                          It's not quote mining as I included your comment in the quote box.
                          Citing a bogus source and yes selectively quote mining.
                          Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                          Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                          But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                          go with the flow the river knows . . .

                          Frank

                          I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Dr. Campbell -- Viral transmission not tested in Pfizer trials



                            Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

                            Beige Federalist.

                            Nationalist Christian.

                            "Everybody is somebody's heretic."

                            Social Justice is usually the opposite of actual justice.

                            Proud member of the this space left blank community.

                            Would-be Grand Vizier of the Padishah Maxi-Super-Ultra-Hyper-Mega-MAGA King Trumpius Rex.

                            Justice for Ashli Babbitt!

                            Justice for Matthew Perna!

                            Arrest Ray Epps and his Fed bosses!

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post

                              Citing a bogus source and yes selectively quote mining.
                              You obviously aren't following along. I quoted Roy in full context - isolated one comment that he made and responded to it, because it was a dumb comment. If it was mined then there would be no full text in the post, no full context, and if that was "quote mined" then half the posts on TWEB would also qualify.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Dr. Campbell -- Vax RNA in breast milk --
                                Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

                                Beige Federalist.

                                Nationalist Christian.

                                "Everybody is somebody's heretic."

                                Social Justice is usually the opposite of actual justice.

                                Proud member of the this space left blank community.

                                Would-be Grand Vizier of the Padishah Maxi-Super-Ultra-Hyper-Mega-MAGA King Trumpius Rex.

                                Justice for Ashli Babbitt!

                                Justice for Matthew Perna!

                                Arrest Ray Epps and his Fed bosses!

                                Comment

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