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Roadside Memorials

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  • Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
    On the contrary I fully understand human emotions.
    Your presence here has demonstrated either a lack of understanding or at total disregard.

    However, I also understand that some of our behaviours regarding rites of passage have ancient antecedents.
    And, again... WHO CARES? Why don't you start a thread on that and stop derailing this one with it?
    The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

      As are Humanist funerals. Those emotions are not specific to Christians.
      You skipped the major difference --- we have the assurance, which you are here to mock, that we'll see our loved ones again.
      The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

        You skipped the major difference --- we have the assurance, which you are here to mock, that we'll see our loved ones again.
        I do not think I have mocked anyone's loss of a loved one.

        I will challenge preconceived beliefs, but I am hardly the only one doing that on these boards.
        "It ain't necessarily so
        The things that you're liable
        To read in the Bible
        It ain't necessarily so
        ."

        Sportin' Life
        Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

          And with that I agree. Fifteen years ago a very dear friend had a stroke that have left him totally incapacitated. He had always been a great outdoor person, skier, rock climber, and hiker and to be left completely paralysed as well reliant on others for his most basic needs would have been a torture for him. A few weeks after that stroke he suffered a fatal heart attack. And that we all felt was, for him, the best thing to have happened.

          However, that has not prevented us from still greatly missing him.

          And those of other faiths who also believe in an after-life will take the same comfort from that, even though I could not do so.

          That is true even for non Christians

          And that gives Christians and other faiths that believe in some form of afterlife comfort. However, for myself, it is final. I cannot believe I will ever see my parents, friends, family or my partner and children in some future eternity.

          However, I do recognise that our physical remains go back into the various cycles that will assist in producing new life.
          Totally reasonable commentary!

          And now we depart into quackery....

          And that brings me back to my earlier question which includes the fact that these individuals have died prematurely - before their allotted span. And the beliefs surrounding that sudden, premature, and violent death have very deep cultural roots.
          I have presided over the funerals of countless people, and have been in ministry to the bereaved for over 50 years ---- I have NEVER, NOT ONCE, had anybody ask about, share about, or care about how things were done in ancient times.

          And, more quackery....

          In the Classical world such people were termed the Aroi i.e. those who had died before time, cheated of their full span of life. And it was believed that because they had not been able to enjoy their life to its natural conclusion their spirits/ghosts were restless and stayed back to haunt the living [and could also be malevolent] in their envy of those still alive.

          Likewise those who had died by violence the Bi[ai]othanatoi [particularly murder victims and suicides] were believed to be among the most resentful of spirits.

          There was also a deep belief that the spirit [or at least part of the spirit] haunted the place of death, even though the corpse was elsewhere.

          And such spirits needed to be propitiated by offerings and gifts.
          You seem obsessed with the duty of providing totally useless information on subjects where that has no bearing to present times.
          The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
            I do not think I have mocked anyone's loss of a loved one.
            You're mocking the whole concept. You're just not very self-aware.

            I will challenge preconceived beliefs, but I am hardly the only one doing that on these boards.
            There are several atheists on here with whom I get along just great -- they don't present themselves as knowed-up snobs who have to work ancient literature into every conversation to show how smart they are.

            The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post


              Your presence here has demonstrated either a lack of understanding or at total disregard.
              My comments have indicated that not everyone thinks as you do. If I merely acquiesced and agreed with you I doubt you would be so antagonistic.

              And I suspect that is what you would really prefer, or at the very least not to have your views/opinions directly challenged.
              "It ain't necessarily so
              The things that you're liable
              To read in the Bible
              It ain't necessarily so
              ."

              Sportin' Life
              Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                It was intended as a jocular [albeit perhaps tactless] remark. Nor did CP appear overly exercised by it when I posted it.

                If I have given offence I can only write "sorry".


                If only you had stopped there.


                Securely anchored to the Rock amid every storm of trial, testing or tribulation.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
                  My comments have indicated that not everyone thinks as you do.
                  The world would be SUCH a better place.

                  If I merely acquiesced and agreed with you I doubt you would be so antagonistic.
                  Again, I get along well with several others on here with whom I have very little in common -- I treat them as friends.
                  In fact, from time to time, when I realize things are getting testy, I back off and focus on the areas where we do agree.

                  And I suspect that is what you would really prefer, or at the very least not to have your views/opinions directly challenged.
                  No, I just have a very low tolerance for arrogant knowed-up s.

                  The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

                    Totally reasonable commentary!

                    And now we depart into quackery....



                    I have presided over the funerals of countless people, and have been in ministry to the bereaved for over 50 years ---- I have NEVER, NOT ONCE, had anybody ask about, share about, or care about how things were done in ancient times.

                    And, more quackery....



                    You seem obsessed with the duty of providing totally useless information on subjects where that has no bearing to present times.
                    Of course all that has some bearing. We do not live in a cultural vacuum. Does the term cultural diffusion mean anything to you?
                    "It ain't necessarily so
                    The things that you're liable
                    To read in the Bible
                    It ain't necessarily so
                    ."

                    Sportin' Life
                    Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                      Why do you assume [premised on what I have written] that I have something against these memorials/shrines?

                      I merely made an observation that the underlying motives for such memorials/shrines have a much deeper cultural resonance.

                      The question pertains as to why people feel the need to create such memorials/shrines at the exact place [i.e. the road-side] where someone they loved died and often leave what are tantamount to grave goods

                      After all the loved ones' remains [ashes or grave] are elsewhere and, if a grave, can be visited.

                      So what underlies that need to commemorate the place where that individual [or individuals] prematurely met their death?
                      Why don’t you find one of those people who’ve set up a memorial for someone they’ve lost and ask them.


                      Securely anchored to the Rock amid every storm of trial, testing or tribulation.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
                        Of course all that has some bearing. We do not live in a cultural vacuum. Does the term cultural diffusion mean anything to you?
                        I think you're a classic example of somebody who prides themselves on 'knowing things', loves to try to show how smart they are, loves to argue for the sake of arguing, but has little to no impact in real life.

                        The first to state his case seems right until another comes and cross-examines him.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post
                          There are cultural antecedents for flowers/flowering plants being associated with certain rites of passage.

                          She was not "telling" me, she made a suggestion..

                          I was telling you. It wasn’t a suggestion. It is based in things I have read, and as I "suggested", do your own search. I’m sure your superior intellect can help you a little itty bit in doing that.


                          Securely anchored to the Rock amid every storm of trial, testing or tribulation.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by rogue06 View Post
                            The motives for doing something during the Stone Age don't necessarily transfer to today. They may have made fires in part to ward off evil spirits, but I seriously doubt that is a reason today.
                            One might ask why do people [even those not openly religious] often carry candles or lights of some sort at memorials or vigils and often leave lighted candles at places acting as a memorial site to someone's death?

                            This is a photograph of part of one of the vigils held around Britain for Sarah Everard, kidnapped, raped, and murdered by a police officer.


                            Last edited by Hypatia_Alexandria; 07-15-2022, 09:49 AM.
                            "It ain't necessarily so
                            The things that you're liable
                            To read in the Bible
                            It ain't necessarily so
                            ."

                            Sportin' Life
                            Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Cow Poke View Post

                              I think you're a classic example of somebody who prides themselves on 'knowing things', loves to try to show how smart they are, loves to argue for the sake of arguing, but has little to no impact in real life.
                              Why do you repeatedly refer to my "know all" attitude? It does appear to be the cause of your ire and I wonder why that is so. .

                              And this is not real life - this is the internet.
                              Last edited by Hypatia_Alexandria; 07-15-2022, 09:59 AM.
                              "It ain't necessarily so
                              The things that you're liable
                              To read in the Bible
                              It ain't necessarily so
                              ."

                              Sportin' Life
                              Porgy & Bess, DuBose Heyward, George & Ira Gershwin

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Hypatia_Alexandria View Post

                                One might ask why do people [even those not openly religious] often carry candles or lights of some sort at memorials or vigils and often leave lighted candles at places acting as a memorial site to someone's death?

                                This is a photograph of part of one of the vigils held around Britain for Sarah Everard, kidnapped, raped, and murdered by a police officer.


                                Same reasons as we have been telling you all along. Out of sympathy, respect and love. They want to memorialize the person and keep their memory alive.

                                But I suppose you think they do it so they don't come back and haunt anyone.

                                Comment

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