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Paleo diet - Bad News

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Darth Executor View Post
    Potatoes, corn and white rice are all complex carbs...

    You can (and should) also get complex carbs from vegetables. Grains, whole or otherwise, are nowhere near necessary.
    Did you take an organic chem class or listen to a nutrition lecture?
    Lesson one A complex carbohydrate is made up of a compound from more than two molecules of a Saccharide. A potato is a long chain of glucose molecules and some amylose however lacks a great deal of cellulose. While high in fiber due to the ability to easily be broken up in the body, a potato is a sugar/water combo that is good but not a "whole grain," and for diabetics can really hurt. Corn is another starch, cellulose, amylose and a high glucose content, It counts less as a vegetable and between complexity and simple, its also easy to digest and part of a "low residue" diet. One problem with it, Its great for you, but for people with certain digestive ailments, its really irritating and shouldn't be eaten. The grain or berry of a grain, in addition to a high fruit and vegetable diet (not white rice but whole rice un processed) Is a plant based ground complex starch containing large amounts of amylose cellulose and different plant fibers, which are excellent for digestive systems and absorb a lot of stomach acid and assist with fecal digestion and kidney function along with fruits vegetables etc. they also contain protein, are far better choices and yes are a necessity, without which constipation will ensue. They also absorb high amounts of cholesterol taken in by meats.
    A happy family is but an earlier heaven.
    George Bernard Shaw

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    • #17
      Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
      I question the argument that lose of muscle as one ages (scaropenia) is related to the necessity of eating more meat. In fact modern research supports that this is most definitely not the case. Scaropenia is related to changes in metabolic processes of aging. It is a little complex to deal with here, but a google search may help you to understand it. I may post a n understandable layman's article if I find one. The high consumption of meat by older people can have far more detrimental effects then positive .
      I didn't say eating less meat caused muscle loss. My doc was telling me that as we age we lose muscle and eating more meat and protein (and excercising) can counteract that loss.


      As for me, I think I will stick to my diet of refined sugar, high fructose corn syrup and GMO vegetables!

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      • #18
        I think I'll just eat what my pregnancy doctor tells me too rather than reason with quacky people...
        A happy family is but an earlier heaven.
        George Bernard Shaw

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Sparko View Post
          As for me, I think I will stick to my diet of refined sugar, high fructose corn syrup and GMO vegetables!
          Wot? No bacon?
          "If you can ever make any major religion look absolutely ludicrous, chances are you haven't understood it"
          -Ravi Zacharias, The New Age: A foreign bird with a local walk

          Be watchful, stand firm in the faith, act like men, be strong.
          1 Corinthians 16:13

          "...he [Doherty] is no historian and he is not even conversant with the historical discussions of the very matters he wants to pontificate on."
          -Ben Witherington III

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          • #20
            Originally posted by raphael View Post
            Wot? No bacon?
            it counts as a meat
            A happy family is but an earlier heaven.
            George Bernard Shaw

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by Darth Executor View Post
              Potatoes, corn and white rice are all complex carbs...

              You can (and should) also get complex carbs from vegetables. Grains, whole or otherwise, are nowhere near necessary.
              Well, I disagree, Potatoes are likely the highest in high carb vegetable list. White rice is definitely a problem vs brown rice.

              [cite = http://ezinearticles.com/?List-of-Si...ds&id=1107314] The most important simple carbohydrates to limit in your diet include:
              Soda
              Candy
              Artificial syrups
              Sugar
              White rice, white bread, and white pasta
              Potatoes (which are technically a complex carb, but act more like simple carbs in the body)
              Pastries and desserts [/cite]

              It is the behavior in the body when the carbs turn to sugar that counts, Potatoes, white rice act like simple carbs. I will address corn next.

              go with the flow the river knows. . .

              Frank
              Last edited by shunyadragon; 01-19-2014, 07:28 PM.
              Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
              Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
              But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

              go with the flow the river knows . . .

              Frank

              I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

              Comment


              • #22
                The issue is ratio. Foods like corn, potatoes, and white rice have high carbohydrate rations, even though they may be on the list of containing complex carbs, but they are high in simple carbs. I go by references and recommendations for Diabetes, which emphasis how quickly the carbs convert to sugar in your body. Foods like yams, sweet potatoes, carrots, whole grains and brown rice are on the good carb list. I have type 2 Diabetes, and control it by diet only.

                [cite = http://ezinearticles.com/?Being-Sens...id=7020871]You can judge how many carbohydrates are in a vegetable by the amount of starch that is in the vegetable. Corn and potatoes have high ratios of carbohydrates while peas and broccoli are low in these problem causers. You have to measure the amount of carbohydrates in your meal wisely. [/cite]

                I do not think there is rigid rule do not eat corn and potatoes, some source recommend low amounts with good vegetables and grains, but I believe that are many better choices in diverse diet.

                go with the flow the river knows . . .

                Frank
                Last edited by shunyadragon; 01-19-2014, 07:38 PM.
                Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                go with the flow the river knows . . .

                Frank

                I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
                  Well, I disagree, Potatoes are likely the highest in high carb vegetable list. White rice is definitely a problem vs brown rice.
                  White rice doesn't have as many nutrients. It's also fairly harmless, whereas brown rice, like potatoes, is somewhat toxic. If you get your nutrients elsewhere it's a non-issue. I'm not saying they're better or even just as good as brown rice, I just don't think grains are actually necessary. And while anecdotal, I know several people who swear by ignoring grains altogether.

                  Originally posted by shunyadragon View Post
                  The issue is ratio. Foods like corn, potatoes, and white rice have high carbohydrate rations, even though they may be on the list of containing complex carbs, but they are high in simple carbs. I go by references and recommendations for Diabetes, which emphasis how quickly the carbs convert to sugar in your body. Foods like yams, sweet potatoes, carrots, whole grains and brown rice are on the good carb list. I have type 2 Diabetes, and control it by diet only.
                  Well, the problem is that with diabetes your body isn't producing insulin well, so stuff that require spikes to process are bad for you. I'm not at all convinced that this is also applicable to people without similar health issues. And if you do any serious exercise you pretty much need faster acting carbs for energy.
                  "As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause thee to err, and destroy the way of thy paths." Isaiah 3:12

                  There is no such thing as innocence, only degrees of guilt.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Raphael View Post
                    Wot? No bacon?
                    Bacon is too healthy.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Darth Executor View Post
                      White rice doesn't have as many nutrients. It's also fairly harmless, whereas brown rice, like potatoes, is somewhat toxic. If you get your nutrients elsewhere it's a non-issue. I'm not saying they're better or even just as good as brown rice, I just don't think grains are actually necessary. And while anecdotal, I know several people who swear by ignoring grains altogether.

                      Well, the problem is that with diabetes your body isn't producing insulin well, so stuff that require spikes to process are bad for you. I'm not at all convinced that this is also applicable to people without similar health issues. And if you do any serious exercise you pretty much need faster acting carbs for energy.
                      You will have to document your statement about brown rice being toxic???, because I have no references where this is so. Primal humans of Africa did not have potatoes, white rice, sugar, or corn and they were not lacking of energy for their intensive life style of hunting and foraging for food. They did had have the tubers, whole wild grains, and meat and fish from the rivers, lakes and oceans. The question here is what in reality was the Paleo-Diet.
                      the problem of Diabetes is not only the disease itself, but the prevalence of disease within a population as well as obesity. The higher in white carbs the higher in Diabetes and obesity is universal When Chinese diets changed in the 1980s and 1990s the Diabetes and obesity increased to equivalent to the USA. Before it was less than 1% of the population. The change was in the higher consumption of white carbs and meat. When I moved there in 1999 there were about 6 fast food restaurants like MacDonald's, now there are tens of thousands.
                      Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                      Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                      But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                      go with the flow the river knows . . .

                      Frank

                      I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Is it not true that potato starch gets converted to sugar and hence causes blood sugar spikes (bad for just about everyone) eventually?
                        The greater number of laws . . . , the more thieves . . . there will be. ---- Lao-Tzu

                        [T]he truth I’m after and the truth never harmed anyone. What harms us is to persist in self-deceit and ignorance -— Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Truthseeker View Post
                          Is it not true that potato starch gets converted to sugar and hence causes blood sugar spikes (bad for just about everyone) eventually?
                          Your claim is not correct and needs references to support it. The following is more accurate.

                          [cite = http://lowcarbdiets.about.com/od/wha...egetables.htm] "When we think of root vegetables, we often think of potatoes, but potatoes are very high in starch, and have a high glycemic index (the only vegetable with a higher one is parsnips). This is another way of saying that the carbohydrate in potatoes is rapidly turned into sugar and absorbed into the blood. However, many root vegetables can be substituted for potatoes. Here are carb and fiber counts for various root vegetables which might be used instead of potatoes. (Other vegetables such as cauliflower can also be substituted, for an even lower carb count.)" [/cite]

                          The glycemic index is the best measure of how a food is involved in the digestive process. The bottom line is potatoes are NOT originally a part of the Paleo Diet.
                          Last edited by shunyadragon; 01-20-2014, 01:13 PM.
                          Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                          Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                          But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                          go with the flow the river knows . . .

                          Frank

                          I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            One of questions recently understood better about the Paleo Diet is how did all these grains and good healthy veggie stuff got into the our Paleolithic ancestors. New research supports that the conclusion that they ate stomach contents of their herbivore prey. Now if you really want a Paleo Diet, well . . .

                            http://lowcarbdiets.about.com/od/wha...vegetables.htm
                            Glendower: I can call spirits from the vasty deep.
                            Hotspur: Why, so can I, or so can any man;
                            But will they come when you do call for them? Shakespeare’s Henry IV, Part 1, Act III:

                            go with the flow the river knows . . .

                            Frank

                            I do not know, therefore everything is in pencil.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Why are any of you choosing to eat this way? Is it for good health? Many of my friends eat paleo but they do so to feed their narcissism.
                              The last Christian left at tweb

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Trout View Post
                                Why are any of you choosing to eat this way? Is it for good health? Many of my friends eat paleo but they do so to feed their narcissism.
                                I think that is the main reason. That way you are with the latest fashion when it comes to eating.

                                give me steak and potatoes.

                                Comment

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