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Natural Immunity - Evidently The CDC Needs to be Told This is a Thing

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  • Natural Immunity - Evidently The CDC Needs to be Told This is a Thing



    Johns Hopkins professor says 'ignore the CDC' — 'natural immunity works'

    ...

    Dr. Marty Makary, who also serves as a professor at the Bloomberg School of Public Health, suggested during a Tuesday appearance on "The Vince Coglianese Show" that 150 million Americans, or "half the country," likely already have natural immunity to COVID-19 due to having been infected with the virus and then recovering.

    Yet despite that staggering figure, Makary lamented the fact that the CDC, in concert with Biden administration officials, have neglected to recognize the reality of the situation. Instead, previously infected individuals who decline being vaccinated are routinely "demonized" by health officials who insist that virtually all Americans must be vaccinated before normal life can resume.

    But "herd immunity" has already been reached, argued Makary, citing up-to-date vaccination and infection data to suggest that 80% to 85% of Americans are currently protected from the virus.

    "I never thought I'd say this, but please ignore the CDC guidance," Makary stated, advising Americans to "live a normal life, unless you are unvaccinated and did not have the infection, in which case you need to be careful."

    ...




    I'm kinda curious how the heck anyone thinks vaccine immunity works if natural immunity doesn't?

    This is why you shouldn't teach evolution* in schools - evidently, it prevents kids from learning to actually think!








































































    *Yep, hyperbolic and completely unfair - but it got you to read the foot note! . But seriously, if no one understands the basics of the theories of vaccination, we really need to revamp science education in schools. Maybe less 'fact' based and more methodology based. Anything that gets people to think this stuff through for themselves.
    "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

    "Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman

    My Personal Blog

    My Novella blog (Current Novella Begins on 7/25/14)

    Quill Sword

  • #2
    Yep. that is what I kept saying when idjuts around here said you needed to keep wearing a mask even if you were vaccinated. If you are vaccinated, you aren't going to get sick or spread the disease, That's how vaccines work. Unless like in my case, you have some immunity problem. Which you would already know about like I did. And then the danger is more that YOU would catch the disease than you would spread it, thus wearing a mask wouldn't protect you unless it was an N95 mask.

    Comment


    • #3
      We learned from Mumbai and Manaus that herd immunity through infection can't really be counted upon. If the vaccines can't do better than that, we really are in trouble.

      Fortunately, there is evidence that the vaccines provoke a more reliable immune response than infection, especially against other variants.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Stoic View Post
        We learned from Mumbai and Manaus that herd immunity through infection can't really be counted upon. If the vaccines can't do better than that, we really are in trouble.

        Fortunately, there is evidence that the vaccines provoke a more reliable immune response than infection, especially against other variants.
        They were claiming that India had herd immunity with only 1/5 of the population infected/recovered. Everything the CDC and others have been saying all along is that you need something like 75-80% to have herd immunity. Also India has been terrible with how they have handled the virus and the vaccines.

        The vaccines shouldn't be any more effective than natural immunity. If anything natural immunity should be better because the body was fighting off the actual virus instead of just a fake spike protein like the vaccine uses.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Sparko View Post
          They were claiming that India had herd immunity with only 1/5 of the population infected/recovered. Everything the CDC and others have been saying all along is that you need something like 75-80% to have herd immunity. Also India has been terrible with how they have handled the virus and the vaccines.
          It was estimated in January that over half the population of Mumbai had immunity because they had antibodies to covid-19. So the second wave shouldn't have been as bad as the first. But it was worse.

          The vaccines shouldn't be any more effective than natural immunity. If anything natural immunity should be better because the body was fighting off the actual virus instead of just a fake spike protein like the vaccine uses.
          https://www.contagionlive.com/view/i...ural-infection

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Stoic View Post
            It was estimated in January that over half the population of Mumbai had immunity because they had antibodies to covid-19. So the second wave shouldn't have been as bad as the first. But it was worse.
            half still isn't 80% and again India's handling of the pandemic is pretty bad.


            I stand corrected.


            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Sparko View Post

              I stand corrected.
              Or maybe natural immunity-by-infection -- even mild infection -- provides lifelong protection.
              Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

              Beige Nationalist.

              "Everybody is somebody's heretic."

              Social Justice is usually the opposite of actual justice.

              Comment


              • #8
                And then we have this.


                Yeah, while those aren't catastrophic stats, I don't think numbers that high, with the CDC assuming underreporting, are an indication of anything good.
                "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

                "Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman

                My Personal Blog

                My Novella blog (Current Novella Begins on 7/25/14)

                Quill Sword

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Teallaura View Post
                  And then we have this.


                  Yeah, while those aren't catastrophic stats, I don't think numbers that high, with the CDC assuming underreporting, are an indication of anything good.
                  You are aware that the vaccines were never claimed to be 100% effective, right?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Teallaura View Post
                    And then we have this.


                    Yeah, while those aren't catastrophic stats, I don't think numbers that high, with the CDC assuming underreporting, are an indication of anything good.
                    This part

                    The CDC stated in April that there is “no evidence that vaccination contributed to patient deaths” reported by the Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System.


                    is so absolute that I find it impossible to trust. It would be the first vaccination in history that gave "no" such evidence.
                    Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

                    Beige Nationalist.

                    "Everybody is somebody's heretic."

                    Social Justice is usually the opposite of actual justice.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by NorrinRadd View Post

                      This part

                      The CDC stated in April that there is “no evidence that vaccination contributed to patient deaths” reported by the Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System.


                      is so absolute that I find it impossible to trust. It would be the first vaccination in history that gave "no" such evidence.
                      As of May, there have been a few.

                      https://www.cnbc.com/2021/05/12/cdc-...d-vaccine.html


                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Teallaura View Post
                        *Yep, hyperbolic and completely unfair - but it got you to read the foot note! . But seriously, if no one understands the basics of the theories of vaccination, we really need to revamp science education in schools. Maybe less 'fact' based and more methodology based. Anything that gets people to think this stuff through for themselves.
                        I'm fully vaccinated since April 6, and fully intend to pick up my booster when it becomes available.

                        So this kind of misinformation, and make no mistake this is deadly misinformation, isn't a threat to me, but it is a threat to the marine's kid, and to Sparko for that matter, and to everyone who hasn't yet been vaccinated or achieved some degree of natural immunity. Transplant recipients are particularly at risk due to their need to maintain themselves on immunosuppressive medications.

                        There are fundamental principles being violated here. You don't get legal advice from your mechanic, and even if your mechanic says your engine is sick, you ask for the data. You don't get medical advice from right-wing partisan fringe sites. And if you absolutely must, you make sure there are data supporting the information.

                        Where are the data showing half of America has been infected? They don't exist, because it's not true. Existing data show the declines in infections are directly linked to vaccinations which were on the cusp of half of Americans a week ago, and that the unvaccinated remain at high risk.

                        'A tale of two societies': As infections plunge among the vaccinated, the unvaccinated remain at high risk
                        .
                        The declines in Covid-19 cases and deaths are coming as more Americans are getting vaccinated. According to CDC, 49.2% of the U.S. population has received at least one dose of a Covid-19 vaccine, while 39.2% have received all doses required in their vaccination course. Meanwhile, 61.3% of American adults have received at least one shot, while 49.6% have received all required doses. In at least 25 states and Washington, D.C., more than half of their adults have received all required doses.

                        Covid-19 cases remain high among the unvaccinated

                        But while national Covid-19 case and death rates are painting a favorable picture of the United States' fight against Covid-19, case rates and death rates among the unvaccinated remain high, according to the Washington Post.

                        The rate of Covid-19 cases among the unvaccinated is 69% higher than the standard national rates, according to the Post, though it is declining. Meanwhile, the death rate among the unvaccinated is about the same as it was two months ago, and the hospitalization rate is as high as it was three months ago.

                        This is the WaPo interactive cited:

                        The unseen covid-19 risk for unvaccinated people
                        .
                        Washington State:

                        2021-05-29_16-05-25.jpg

                        Selection pressure favors the variants with higher reproduction numbers. That's the math. And world travel guarantees those variants will arrive here all too soon. Now would be a good time to protect yourselves, and your loved ones, and the immunocompromised members of your communities.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Stoic View Post

                          You are aware that the vaccines were never claimed to be 100% effective, right?
                          You're aware that they shouldn't be failing at that level, right?
                          "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

                          "Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman

                          My Personal Blog

                          My Novella blog (Current Novella Begins on 7/25/14)

                          Quill Sword

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Stoic View Post

                            As of May, there have been a few.

                            https://www.cnbc.com/2021/05/12/cdc-...d-vaccine.html

                            Yep - which doesn't help the case. The CDC knew better than make that particular statement - it was way too early and the epidemiology guys at least knew it.

                            And seriously, their data collection seems to be crap - what the devil are all the DIS doing? Not the infection control DIS - the vaccination program DIS. This is straight up their alley and it's a reasonably easy crosstrain for nurses (literally every immunology DIS I've ever met was a nurse). They hired a ton of infection control DIS countrywide - how hard is it to have them do the raw collection for the immunology DIS? Not at all - we STD DIS were crosstrained in TB and that's a much harder leap!

                            "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

                            "Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman

                            My Personal Blog

                            My Novella blog (Current Novella Begins on 7/25/14)

                            Quill Sword

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Juvenal View Post

                              I'm fully vaccinated since April 6, and fully intend to pick up my booster when it becomes available.

                              So this kind of misinformation, and make no mistake this is deadly misinformation, isn't a threat to me, but it is a threat to the marine's kid, and to Sparko for that matter, and to everyone who hasn't yet been vaccinated or achieved some degree of natural immunity. Transplant recipients are particularly at risk due to their need to maintain themselves on immunosuppressive medications.

                              There are fundamental principles being violated here. You don't get legal advice from your mechanic, and even if your mechanic says your engine is sick, you ask for the data. You don't get medical advice from right-wing partisan fringe sites. And if you absolutely must, you make sure there are data supporting the information.

                              Where are the data showing half of America has been infected? They don't exist, because it's not true. Existing data show the declines in infections are directly linked to vaccinations which were on the cusp of half of Americans a week ago, and that the unvaccinated remain at high risk.

                              'A tale of two societies': As infections plunge among the vaccinated, the unvaccinated remain at high risk
                              .
                              The declines in Covid-19 cases and deaths are coming as more Americans are getting vaccinated. According to CDC, 49.2% of the U.S. population has received at least one dose of a Covid-19 vaccine, while 39.2% have received all doses required in their vaccination course. Meanwhile, 61.3% of American adults have received at least one shot, while 49.6% have received all required doses. In at least 25 states and Washington, D.C., more than half of their adults have received all required doses.

                              Covid-19 cases remain high among the unvaccinated

                              But while national Covid-19 case and death rates are painting a favorable picture of the United States' fight against Covid-19, case rates and death rates among the unvaccinated remain high, according to the Washington Post.

                              The rate of Covid-19 cases among the unvaccinated is 69% higher than the standard national rates, according to the Post, though it is declining. Meanwhile, the death rate among the unvaccinated is about the same as it was two months ago, and the hospitalization rate is as high as it was three months ago.

                              This is the WaPo interactive cited:

                              The unseen covid-19 risk for unvaccinated people
                              .
                              Washington State:

                              2021-05-29_16-05-25.jpg

                              Selection pressure favors the variants with higher reproduction numbers. That's the math. And world travel guarantees those variants will arrive here all too soon. Now would be a good time to protect yourselves, and your loved ones, and the immunocompromised members of your communities.
                              You do realize that doesn't refute the OP, right? Especially not coming out of Washington state - riots are not a good mix with disease control. Exactly the opposite, actually, assuming the usual tactic of importing the crazies.

                              And unless there's a footnote buried somewhere - those case numbers are miniscule. They seem to be in real numbers on the graph - not in hundreds or thousands. Which is really lower than I'd expect - where's the key for that thing?
                              "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

                              "Forgiveness is the way of love." Gary Chapman

                              My Personal Blog

                              My Novella blog (Current Novella Begins on 7/25/14)

                              Quill Sword

                              Comment

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