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What percentage of Americans need to be vaccinated to make a dent?

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  • #16
    One of the most neglected stats for any treatment is the "Number Needed To" treat, vaccinate, whatever.

    For the Moderna vax, the NNTV to prevent even a single case of severe illness is 1370. (Based on data available at time of Nov. 22 article.)

    For the Pfizer vax, the NNTV to prevent one case of COVID-19 is 256. (Based on data available at time of Nov. 13 article.)

    Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

    Beige Nationalist.

    "Everybody is somebody's heretic."

    Social Justice is usually the opposite of actual justice.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by NorrinRadd View Post
      One of the most neglected stats for any treatment is the "Number Needed To" treat, vaccinate, whatever.

      For the Moderna vax, the NNTV to prevent even a single case of severe illness is 1370. (Based on data available at time of Nov. 22 article.)

      For the Pfizer vax, the NNTV to prevent one case of COVID-19 is 256. (Based on data available at time of Nov. 13 article.)
      I have to wonder if you really don't understand that a lot more of those people would have serious illnesses given enough time.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by mikewhitney View Post

        Those darn scientists ... the source of all misinformation. Trust Fauci. Trust Gates. They only have big profits to gain but no reason to distort the truth.

        Their motto is "let us make a lot of people sick in order to avoid some deaths that are not as likely to happen anymore." The numbers don't work, Mr. Stoic.
        If you think scientists are the source of all misinformation, there is no use talking to you.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Stoic View Post

          If you think scientists are the source of all misinformation, there is no use talking to you.
          sarcasm easily can go over one's head. My information comes form scientists, for the most part. And people just do not pay attention to the science. So we turn it back to you. Will you listen to the scientists?

          The cures are here now. And Ivermectin even helps prevent it -- for those who are being cautious. There is no need to make people sick with an experimental vaccine when the effective treatment has been found for those who start to encounter this coronavirus. This is like any disease which can affect people. If their immune systems were weak, then they get treated at the hospital.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by mikewhitney View Post

            sarcasm easily can go over one's head. My information comes form scientists, for the most part. And people just do not pay attention to the science. So we turn it back to you. Will you listen to the scientists?

            The cures are here now. And Ivermectin even helps prevent it -- for those who are being cautious. There is no need to make people sick with an experimental vaccine when the effective treatment has been found for those who start to encounter this coronavirus.
            There are no cures, and the treatments available aren't all that effective. That's why we have thousands of people dying from it every day.

            Ivermectin may one day prove to be better than nothing against covid-19. But it has its own side-effects.

            In the meantime, we have vaccines which have been proven to provide immunity.

            This is like any disease which can affect people. If their immune systems were weak, then they get treated at the hospital.
            This disease has taken down people when there was no reason to doubt the strength of their immune systems.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Stoic View Post
              There are no cures, and the treatments available aren't all that effective. That's why we have thousands of people dying from it every day.

              Ivermectin may one day prove to be better than nothing against covid-19. But it has its own side-effects.

              In the meantime, we have vaccines which have been proven to provide immunity.


              This disease has taken down people when there was no reason to doubt the strength of their immune systems.
              Are you kidding me? Just go and look at the studies. Go to c19study.com and click on the Ivermectin link. Even HCQ, if it had been used early on, would have cut the deaths way down.

              Vaccines are an unknown right now. Worse, the vaccines have bad side effects. Please tell me you were not serious about your post here.

              Maybe the one caveat is that I have not checked if the Ivermectin studies use the same trick of "improvement" that the vaccine manufacturers have used.

              The trick is to say, for example, there is a 33% reduction of deaths. So there might be 3 people who die (for whatever reasons) in the placebo group and 2 people die with the vaccine. So there are 1/3 reduction of deaths compared to the placebo group. If we are talking about 20,000 people in both groups, the statistics are built on too small of a group to be statistically relevant.

              If you want to take the vaccine, go ahead. But please warn people that this is a highly experimental vaccine with a new untested technology. The anticipated side effects are nerve-disorders, death, infertility, stroke, seizers, thromboembolisms, Kawasaki disease, Arthritis and more. These may sound delightful to the 1000 or more people who take the vaccine in order to reduce the possible deaths by 1 (for their effort).

              Like I noted elsewhere. The vaccine is only tested to reduce symptoms in the person taking it. The vaccination has not been tested to stop the spread of the virus. It is only selfish reasons why someone would take the vaccine, especially when we have propylaptic and early treatments available, that have a respectable and known safety.
              Last edited by mikewhitney; 12-12-2020, 05:15 PM.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Stoic View Post

                I have to wonder if you really don't understand that a lot more of those people would have serious illnesses given enough time.
                No, I really don't understand that.
                Geislerminian Antinomian Kenotic Charispneumaticostal Gender Mutualist-Egalitarian.

                Beige Nationalist.

                "Everybody is somebody's heretic."

                Social Justice is usually the opposite of actual justice.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by NorrinRadd View Post
                  No, I really don't understand that.
                  When they run these trials, they aren't deliberately trying to infect people. They are simply waiting for people to become infected. The longer they wait, the more people who will be infected.

                  But we're in a hurry to get a vaccine approved, so there isn't much time for many people in the placebo group to become infected. So the number of people in the vaccinated group who would have become infected without the vaccine is pretty small, in relation to the number of people vaccinated. If there was more time, more people in the placebo group would have become infected, so the number of people in the vaccinated group who would have been prevented from becoming infected would be larger, without any more people being vaccinated.

                  The end result is, the NNTV to prevent a severe case of covid-19 is dependent on how long you run the trial.

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