Originally posted by Gary
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Comment Thread for The Resurrection of Jesus - Apologiaphoenix vs Gary
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Enter the Church and wash away your sins. For here there is a hospital and not a court of law. Do not be ashamed to enter the Church; be ashamed when you sin, but not when you repent. – St. John Chrysostom
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I recommend you do not try too hard and ...research as little as possible. Such weighty things give me a headache. - Shunyadragon, Baha'i apologist
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Gary can't envisage anything that would justify genocide: wiping a people out, root and branch. No more can I. Killing - even punishing - infants and children - and even adults - for the sins of their parents is a matter the scriptures declare God himself to state to be an affront.
God commanded an action that he himself considers an evil? Not a tenable concept. The children were not killed because of the sins of their parents.
The infants and children were put to death in a means of sparing them an otherwise inevitable slow and tortured death? A rationalisation that flies in the face of the archaeological record.
But the rationalisation does outline a matter that Gary fails to consider: God understands the future.
1/ The possibility cannot be discounted that the impact of any alternative course on the future may have resulted in disastrous outcomes that outweighed the immediate (apparent) atrocity.
2/ God will give a command to "do" and when to do it, without any explanation of why. That is a matter confirmed by both scripture and personal experience.
3/ Aside from an alternative course having an extremely negative impact on the future, I can't think of anything that would justify genocide. That doesn't preclude other possibilities that I am not competent to evaluate.
Atheists are (in the main) extremely adept at noticing rationalisations, far more adept than are Christians (in the main).
Where a lame rationalisation may serve to satisfy a Christian, an atheist will cry foul at first sight.
It isn't that Christians are more gullible than atheists, it is just that atheists are far more practiced at producing rationalisations.1Cor 15:34 Come to your senses as you ought and stop sinning; for I say to your shame, there are some who know not God.
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Scripture before Tradition:
but that won't prevent others from
taking it upon themselves to deprive you
of the right to call yourself Christian.
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Originally posted by tabibito View PostGary can't envisage anything that would justify genocide: wiping a people out, root and branch. No more can I. Killing - even punishing - infants and children - and even adults - for the sins of their parents is a matter the scriptures declare God himself to state to be an affront.
God commanded an action that he himself considers an evil? Not a tenable concept. The children were not killed because of the sins of their parents.
The infants and children were put to death in a means of sparing them an otherwise inevitable slow and tortured death? A rationalisation that flies in the face of the archaeological record.
But the rationalisation does outline a matter that Gary fails to consider: God understands the future.
1/ The possibility cannot be discounted that the impact of any alternative course on the future may have resulted in disastrous outcomes that outweighed the immediate (apparent) atrocity.
2/ God will give a command to "do" and when to do it, without any explanation of why. That is a matter confirmed by both scripture and personal experience.
3/ Aside from an alternative course having an extremely negative impact on the future, I can't think of anything that would justify genocide. That doesn't preclude other possibilities that I am not competent to evaluate.
Atheists are (in the main) extremely adept at noticing rationalisations, far more adept than are Christians (in the main).
Where a lame rationalisation may serve to satisfy a Christian, an atheist will cry foul at first sight.
It isn't that Christians are more gullible than atheists, it is just that atheists are far more practiced at producing rationalisations.
There is NO justification today for this behavior nor is there ANY justification for this behavior in the past or future. Any belief system that justifies the chasing down of helpless, defenseless infants, mothers, children, and old people is evil and the epitome of immorality...by the standards of every civilized people on planet earth.
Stop making excuses for the immorality and barbarism of your belief system! It is evil. Pure evil.Last edited by Gary; 09-04-2015, 11:15 PM.
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There is NO justification today for this behavior nor is there ANY justification for this behavior in the past or future. Any belief system that justifies the chasing down of helpless, defenseless infants, mothers, children, and old people is evil and the epitome of immorality...by the standards of every civilized people on planet earth.1Cor 15:34 Come to your senses as you ought and stop sinning; for I say to your shame, there are some who know not God.
.⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛
Scripture before Tradition:
but that won't prevent others from
taking it upon themselves to deprive you
of the right to call yourself Christian.
⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛
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Originally posted by tabibito View PostYou have an overblown sense of your ability to know all relevant details, sight unseen. If you had even the slightest appreciation of human limitations, you would be aware of just how ludicrous your diatribe is.
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Originally posted by Gary View PostIf you cannot categorically condemn, under all circumstances and in all ages, the chasing down and killing of little children, you are immoral.
But let's run a small exercise - just to see if you are capable of exercising logic and imagination:
Can you think of anything that would justify a man chase down and pick up a 2 year old, then hurl him 10 feet through the air to land in a heap on the ground?Last edited by tabibito; 09-04-2015, 11:50 PM.1Cor 15:34 Come to your senses as you ought and stop sinning; for I say to your shame, there are some who know not God.
.⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛
Scripture before Tradition:
but that won't prevent others from
taking it upon themselves to deprive you
of the right to call yourself Christian.
⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛
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Originally posted by Gary View PostIf you cannot categorically condemn, under all circumstances and in all ages, the chasing down and killing of little children, you are immoral.
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Originally posted by Mikeenders View PostIf I had a shot at Hitler when he was five and knew the future I'd laugh at your morality and consider taking the shot.1Cor 15:34 Come to your senses as you ought and stop sinning; for I say to your shame, there are some who know not God.
.⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛
Scripture before Tradition:
but that won't prevent others from
taking it upon themselves to deprive you
of the right to call yourself Christian.
⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛⊛
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I guess moral dilemmas don't exist in fundy atheist land. God should have just taken the children to heaven instead of having them die. Wait, if the little kids die, they do go to heaven, which is a better place than ancient times were to grow up in. The reason a mother shouldn't murder her baby is that the kid could have grown up to be a great christian. Murdering her baby would just ensure that she and the baby don't get any rewards in heaven. And denying the child the right to make their own choice.If it weren't for the Resurrection of Jesus, we'd all be in DEEP TROUBLE!
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Originally posted by tabibito View PostGiven the outcomes of WWII, even taking the negatives into account, I couldn't be sure that I would.
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