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  • Originally posted by Mikeenders View Post
    Yawn we know - you said that about BAR and Finketsein's friends too and then you starved for breakfast because all the eggs were used up on your facial mask.
    Are you brain-dead, you dip-wad?

    I have already agreed that Finkelstein's associates pointed out that there is settlement activity during ONE of the traditional dates of the Exodus at K-B. What more do you want? My head?? However, that does NOT mean that they believe that this evidence confirms the Exodus.

    Now, pick a date, you fundamentalist ninny, and defend it!

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Gary View Post
      Are you brain-dead, you dip-wad?

      NO against all odds we have survived your posts with no signs of cantagion.

      I have already [been forced by your evidence to agree] that Finkelstein's associates pointed out that there is settlement activity during ONE of the traditional dates of the Exodus at K-B.
      Fixed that for you

      What more do you want? My head??
      Good night! . NOoooooooooooo. Anything but that.

      Now, pick a date, you fundamentalist ninny, and defend it
      Don't need to. My position has always been its still under research and the BAR article and other data confirms me right and you wrong that the debate was over. Sorry the debate that the debate is over is well - over. We now know its not so stay tuned. Until its done and really finished your claims of The Bible being proven wrong are all washed up - Like the first chariot guy rushing into the red sea......gulp.
      Last edited by Mikeenders; 10-12-2015, 02:07 PM.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Gary View Post
        What a load or horse puckey, Tabby. You are quoting a Jewish source for the location of Kadesh-Barnea but then using the crackpot Cornucke's map. Get serious! Kadesh Barnea is further west than Cornucke's invented location. I'm not chasing after any more of your amateurish nonsense. Pick a date, Tabby! When was the Exodus? Stick with one date and defend it. Stop being a "Mike".
        You're the one claiming there is a Kadesh in the Sinai Desert - Find a source that dermonstrates the fact.

        The map shows the location of Kadesh Barnea as being the same described by the Jewish source.


        Rudolph Cohen The Israel Museum, Jerusalem 1983
        ADKadesh-barnea's importance in the history of the Jewish people derives primarily from its biblical association with Israel's sojourn in the desert. As a consequence, numerous scholars of past generations have attempted to equate biblical Kadesh-barnea with sites in Sinai, the Negev, or even more distant places. Early in this century, a general scholarly consensus emerged, identifying Kadesh-barnea with Tell el-Qudeirat, located in the fertile valley watered by the spring of 'Ain el-Qudeirat.


        Note the date on that piece: 1983

        Updated:
        Kadesh Barnea Located at ancient El Beidha, 5 km north of Petra
        It is our conclusion that Kadesh Barnea is located transjordan, at ancient El Beidha 5 km north of Petra. ... Although up to 25 different locations have been proposed for Kadesh Barnea, almost no one today questions that Kadesh is located at Ein el Qudeirat.

        Well well - look at that. Petra is marked on the map too - just south of Kadesh Barnea.

        Kadesh Barnea: A Reevaluation of Its Archaeology and HistoryIsrael Finkelstein Tel Aviv University
        To sum up this point, an Iron I (late 12th to early 10th century BCE [Low Chronology]) occupation layer at Kadesh Barnea is evident (Singer-Avitz 2008).1


        And just to top it all off, Josephus placed Kadesh Barnea in the vicinity of Petra.
        Last edited by tabibito; 10-12-2015, 02:16 PM.
        sigpic1 Cor 15:34 εκνηψατε δικαιως και μη αμαρτανετε αγνωσιαν γαρ θεου τινες εχουσιν προς εντροπην υμιν λεγω

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Mikeenders View Post
          NO against all odds we have survived your posts with no signs of cantagion.



          Fixed that for you



          Good night! . NOoooooooooooo. Anything but that.



          Don't need to. My position has always been its still under research and the BAR article and other data confirms me right and you wrong that the debate was over. Sorry the debate that the debate is over is well - over. We now know its not so stay tuned. Until its done and really finished your claims of The Bible being proven wrong are all washed up - Like the first chariot guy rushing into the red sea......gulp.
          What a little weasel. Runs in and claims victory on a technicality and misunderstanding of terms, and then retreats into his hole when asked to provide his own position.

          You Christians are all over the map on this issue. I should have listened to my atheist friends before I started debating this issue with you guys here on TW. They had repeatedly warned me: "Make sure you pin them down to a date before you debate them on the Exodus! Otherwise, they will be pulling "evidence" from multiple time periods to prove the historicity of this fable".

          Lesson learned.

          Now, will one of you fundamentalists or even a moderate have some intestinal fortitude and actually pick ONE date and defend it???

          Comment


          • Originally posted by tabibito View Post
            You're the one claiming there is a Kadesh in the Sinai Desert - Find a source that dermonstrates the fact.

            The map shows the location of Kadesh Barnea as being the same described by the Jewish source.


            Rudolph Cohen The Israel Museum, Jerusalem 1983
            ADKadesh-barnea's importance in the history of the Jewish people derives primarily from its biblical association with Israel's sojourn in the desert. As a consequence, numerous scholars of past generations have attempted to equate biblical Kadesh-barnea with sites in Sinai, the Negev, or even more distant places. Early in this century, a general scholarly consensus emerged, identifying Kadesh-barnea with Tell el-Qudeirat, located in the fertile valley watered by the spring of 'Ain el-Qudeirat.


            Note the date on that piece: 1983

            Updated:
            Kadesh Barnea Located at ancient El Beidha, 5 km north of Petra
            It is our conclusion that Kadesh Barnea is located transjordan, at ancient El Beidha 5 km north of Petra. ... Although up to 25 different locations have been proposed for Kadesh Barnea, almost no one today questions that Kadesh is located at Ein el Qudeirat.

            Well well - look at that. Petra is marked on the map too - just south of Kadesh Barnea.

            Kadesh Barnea: A Reevaluation of Its Archaeology and HistoryIsrael Finkelstein Tel Aviv University
            To sum up this point, an Iron I (late 12th to early 10th century BCE [Low Chronology]) occupation layer at Kadesh Barnea is evident (Singer-Avitz 2008).1


            And just to top it all off, Josephus placed Kadesh Barnea in the vicinity of Petra.
            Please give the link to the source of your map, Tabby.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Gary View Post
              What a little weasel. Runs in and claims victory on a technicality and misunderstanding of terms, and then retreats into his hole when asked to provide his own position.

              You Christians are all over the map on this issue.

              LOL. there is no evidence but well there is - oh that was just a technicality.....nothing but jokes from Gary this week. As for Christians all over the map. tell you what? pick a date for The eruption of Thera and prove it. No christian or Bible involved in that and all we have is range of dates over a hundreds years and more. Roughly the same time period too and some of the same issues involved - Affected most of the civilized world at the time and we just don't know . Until more data comes in we won't either. Facts and truth is not your stupid consensus nonsense. you don't just pick a date and vote on it and voila - the issue is closed.


              I should have listened to my atheist friends before I started debating this issue with you guys here on TW
              Meh still would have gotten your head handed to you anyway. Call em...why are they not in here? or did you invite them, they saw you embarrassing yourself and leave without posting? Thats cold hearted.....but hey its atheists we are talking about soo what can you expect??

              Lesson learned.
              That will be the day. Page 391 proves otherwise

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Mikeenders View Post
                LOL. there is no evidence but well there is - oh that was just a technicality.....nothing but jokes from Gary this week. As for Christians all over the map. tell you what? pick a date for The eruption of Thera and prove it. No christian or Bible involved in that and all we have is range of dates over a hundreds years and more. Roughly the same time period too and some of the same issues involved - Affected most of the civilized world at the time and we just don't know . Until more data comes in we won't either. Facts and truth is not your stupid consensus nonsense. you don't just pick a date and vote on it and voila - the issue is closed.


                Meh still would have gotten your head handed to you anyway. Call em...why are they not in here? or did you invite them, they saw you embarrassing yourself and leave without posting? Thats cold hearted.....but hey its atheists we are talking about soo what can you expect??



                That will be the day. Page 391 proves otherwise
                The issue is closed that you are a slimy weasel. Anyone who is fair and honest, will see that my error was in assuming that there is one "traditional" date for the alleged Exodus. The fact that there is evidence of a settlement at Kadesh-Barnea during the twelfth century does not change the fact that if you choose the fifteenth century as your "traditional" date, as you say is your position, there is NO evidence.

                You are shameful, pathetic slimeball. Until you grow at least one testicle and put up a specific date, and defend that date and that date alone, I'm done with you, weasel.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by tabibito View Post
                  And just to top it all off, Josephus placed Kadesh Barnea in the vicinity of Petra.
                  Your going to blow his mind Tab. He just found out that scholars are not as certain as he claimed about dates how is he going to process that they are often uncertain about locations too?

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Apologiaphoenix View Post
                    So the evidence given to me about the Scythians was burial sites.

                    You know, what I claimed that we had already found and why it is that that is important.

                    So Gary's evidence to consider that I hadn't supposedly was the evidence that I already gave.
                    Before we go any further, Nick. What date do you pick for the Exodus?

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Gary View Post
                      The issue is closed that you are a slimy weasel. Anyone who is fair and honest, will see that my error was in assuming that there is one "traditional" date for the alleged Exodus.
                      Anyone can scroll back and see that you are lying. You tried to float the same junk about me being on the fringe with a date of 1250 when you hadn't even done the research. Thats dishonest and shows the kind of human being you are. Then in true weasel fashion tried to imply I was lying about my source and quote and that I had conflated two difference sources. Just flip back 2-3 pages dear readers and you will see it with your own eyes. You came screaming and kicking and accusing to the fact you were wrong until you just couldn't anymore and you want brownie points for being FORCED to concede? Not happening.

                      Anyone also can see you claiming the issue was settled when we are still discovering and moving back dates. The facts betrayed you,you were wrong, and all your name calling is just you being what no one is surprised at - you being a sore loser.

                      The fact that there is evidence of a settlement at Kadesh-Barnea during the twelfth century does not change the fact that if you choose the fifteenth century as your "traditional" date, as you say is your position, there is NO evidence.
                      At the moment at that location perhaps not but push things back to the 1400s and 1500s then yeah you have other things to look at - of course you don't knwo that because well you never know anything. You just google and copy and paste

                      By the way you poor hapless soul - The argument is that the pottery stretches back hundreds of years further than believed - so as data comes in lol we may even find Kadesh goes back later too

                      You are shameful, pathetic slimeball
                      .

                      You are a running joke and always have been. Theres not a person in this thread that doesn't realize you are lashing out and name calling because you got exposed yet again for not knowing what you were talking about. So please continue to entertain us

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Gary View Post
                        Before we go any further, Nick. What date do you pick for the Exodus?

                        Nick make him give you a date for the eruption of Thera. When he realizes he can't then we at least will be able to accurately date the eruptions of Gary.

                        Comment


                        • Just as there is a "Kadesh" in Syria, there seems to be two "Kadesh" in the south of the Levant. I recognize Wikipedia is not an authoritative source, but it gives some interesting information about these two sites:

                          Kadesh-Barnea is an oasis south of Canaan, west of Arabah and east of the Brook of Egypt.[3] It is 11 days march by way of Mt. Seir from Horeb (Deut 1:2).

                          As many as eighteen sites have been proposed as the identification of biblical Kadesh.[4] Part of the confusion may arise from the fact that Kadesh is sometimes mentioned in connection with the Desert of Paran (Num. 13:26) and at other times in connection with the Zin Desert (Num. 20:1).[5] This discrepancy has been noted since the time of the medieval commentators, leading some (e.g. Hezekiah bar Manoah) to seek a reconciliatory model, while others (Abraham ibn Ezra and Nahmanides) have proposed two separate sites being identified as Kadesh.

                          A minority of modern scholarship has maintained that there were two sites identified as Kadesh[6]ówestern Kadesh (in the wilderness of Zin) and eastern Kadesh (often associated with Petra, Jordan in the wilderness of Paran). This view seems to be represented by Josephus [7] and Eusebius of Caesarea.[8] Josephus says he recognizes exactly where Miriam is buried and it is by the rock, but he refers to the rock (selah in Hebrew) while writing for the Romans in the lingua franca at the time, which was Greek, and the word for rock in Greek is "petra". The Nabataeans came to Petra in about 400 B.C. knowing it to be an ancient burial ground of caves, and buried their dead on top of the graves used 100 years earlier by the Hebrews.

                          However, since 1905 modern Ain el-Qudeirat in the Wadi el-Ain of the northern Sinai has been widely accepted as the location of biblical Kadesh Barnea. Several Iron Age fortresses have been excavated there. The oldest, a small, elliptical structure dates to the tenth century BC, but was evidently abandoned for some time after the first fort's destruction. A second fort constructed during the eighth century BC (probably during the reign of Uzziah) was destroyed during the seventh century BC, most likely during Manasseh's reign. Two ostraca engraved in Hebrew have been recovered there, suggesting the Israelites did indeed occupy this site.[9] However, these Kadesh-Barnea ostraca are dated to the 8th or 7th century B.C.E. and therefore are hundreds of years too recent to be associated with the biblical Exodus.[10]

                          Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kadesh_(Israel)

                          Comment


                          • Will ANY Christian on your side accept my challenge to pick ONE date (century) for the Exodus and defend it? (I sound like Goliath.)

                            :)

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Gary View Post
                              (I sound like Goliath.)

                              :)
                              More like Herod Agrippa after the worms :)

                              Will ANY Christian on your side accept my challenge
                              You just got beaten again. It doesn't do anyone any benefit to challenge someone who loses so much. Its boring. Get one of your atheist friends you were talking about. Someone who can actually make things interesting. someone, anyone else before we hit page 400 and die of boredom.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Mikeenders View Post
                                More like Herod Agrippa after the worms :)



                                You just got beaten again. It doesn't do anyone any benefit to challenge someone who loses so much. Its boring. Get one of your atheist friends you were talking about. Someone who can actually make things interesting. someone, anyone else before we hit page 400 and die of boredom.
                                Be a good little vermin and go back into your hole, Weasel.

                                It is obviously impossible to have a discussion on the Exodus unless you guys specify the dates and locations of your tall tale.

                                Comment

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