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Commentary thread - Hakeem vs. Boxing Pythagoras - did Jesus die on the cross?

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  • Christianbookworm
    replied
    Originally posted by Hakeem View Post
    To know if Jesus was resurrected while on earth, we need to search the scriptures if Jesus body was raised in glory (1 Corinthians 15:43) that is like the man from heaven (1 Corinthians 15:49) who shines like the sun (Matthew 13:43) in light of the fact that "His (Jesus) face is shining like the sun in its brilliance" in heaven according to Revelation 1:16.

    Had Jesus been dead and resutrected in glory as describled in the Bible, the disciples should have recongnised Jesus IMMEDIATELY. However, this was not the case.
    How can someone recognize Jesus if He chooses to not let them recognize Him? He can apparently keep their brains from making the connection. He can also enter a locked room by showing up inside of it. Without knocking or making a different entrance.

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  • Same Hakeem
    replied
    To know if Jesus was resurrected while on earth, we need to search the scriptures if Jesus body was raised in glory (1 Corinthians 15:43) that is like the man from heaven (1 Corinthians 15:49) who shines like the sun (Matthew 13:43) in light of the fact that "His (Jesus) face is shining like the sun in its brilliance" in heaven according to Revelation 1:16.

    Had Jesus been dead and resutrected in glory as describled in the Bible, the disciples should have recongnised Jesus IMMEDIATELY. However, this was not the case.

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  • Christianbookworm
    replied
    Originally posted by Cerebrum123 View Post
    I think he's talking about when Moses and Elijah appeared at the Transfiguration, but you guys are talking about the Exodus.
    Oh! Didn't realize that. I just thought of glowy human. Anyways, Jesus wasn't dead at the transfiguration either. Elijah was reportedly taken somewhere alive. I'm not sure what happened to him later.

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  • Cerebrum123
    replied
    Originally posted by Sparko View Post
    Moses face shined when he saw God - he did not die but went back down the mountain to deliver the commandments
    I think he's talking about when Moses and Elijah appeared at the Transfiguration, but you guys are talking about the Exodus.

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  • Sparko
    replied
    Moses face shined when he saw God - he did not die but went back down the mountain to deliver the commandments

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  • Same Hakeem
    replied
    Christianbookworm writing " Moses didn't get killed and brought back to life" is not true because Moses was not killed. Moses died and was brought back to life because Hebrews 9:27 "it is once to die"

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  • Christianbookworm
    replied
    Originally posted by Hakeem View Post
    Sparko writing "shining" has nothing to do with being resurrected" is wrong because 1 Corinthians 15:43 says "it is raised in glory" that is shining like the sun according to Matthew 13:43.

    Yes Moses shone because he died then was raised shining. Hebrews 9:27 says "it is once to die"
    Uh no. Moses didn't get killed and brought back to life. The whole point of God only showing a fraction of His glory(His back) was to avoid killing Moses from a full exposure.

    Oh, the two on the road to Emmaus were kept from recognizing Jesus. Let's just say that Jesus has the ability to keep people from recongizing Him if He wants. He doesn't even need a pair of glasses or a mask to pull of that trick either!
    Last edited by Christianbookworm; 07-29-2017, 09:15 PM.

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  • Same Hakeem
    replied
    Thanks Sparko for the info

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  • Same Hakeem
    replied
    Hi Sparko,

    I would like to elaborate more on the "shining" issue;

    Paul in describing the resurrected says "it is sown in dishonor and it is raised in glory" in 1 Corinthians 15:43. Paul goes on to describe the glory of the raised by saying "we will be like the man from heaven" as per 1 Corinthians 15:49 explained by Matthew 13:43 "the righteous will shine like the sun" and supported by Revelation 1:16 "His (Jesus) face was shining like the sun"

    Given the above mentioned biblical verses, Jesus was not resurrected at all because had Jesus been dead and resurrected in glory, the desciples should have been able to recognise his glory easily but they did not on the way to Emmaus.

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  • Same Hakeem
    replied
    Sparko writing "shining" has nothing to do with being resurrected" is wrong because 1 Corinthians 15:43 says "it is raised in glory" that is shining like the sun according to Matthew 13:43.

    Yes Moses shone because he died then was raised shining. Hebrews 9:27 says "it is once to die"

    Leave a comment:


  • Same Hakeem
    replied
    Sparko writing " Recognizing Jesus had nothing to do with whether he was resurrected or not" is wrong because the resurrected will be glorified according to 1 Corinthians 15:43. So had Jesus been dead and resurrected in glory, Jesus should have been identifiable to the disciples on the way to Emmaus eating, walking and talking with Jesus and the disciples would have recognised easily.

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  • Same Hakeem
    replied
    The answer to Sparko question " If he was in disguise, then why?" is that Jesus was in disguise because the Jews would kill him because hecdid not die at all. If Jesus was resurrected and hence immortalised (Luke 20:36), Jesus SHOULD have appeared at least once to any of his alleged killers of the Jews and the Romans because Jesus said in Mark 2:17 "I came not to the righteous but to the sinner"

    The answer to Sparko question "Why would he disguise himself then run around for 40 days showing himself to everyone proving he is alive?" lies in the fact that Jesus appearences were limited to the women, his disciples and the 500 brethren. Not even one single appearence was to one of his alleged killers of the Jews and the Romans after he came out from the tomb during the 40 days.

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  • Sparko
    replied
    Also, Hakeem. If you click "Reply with Quote" at the bottom right side of the post you want to respond to, it will automatically include the words of that post in your reply so you don't have to keep writing "Bill the Cat writing " Jesus "shining" has nothing to do with being resurrected. Moses "shone", as did Jesus at the mount of transfiguration"

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  • Sparko
    replied
    Originally posted by Hakeem View Post
    Thanks Sparko. Now I understand your questions.

    The answer to Sparko questions below lies in the fact the disciples thought he should be dead in the tomb for three days and three nights because they heard from other sources that he died on the cross and was laid in tomb. All their source of what happened to him is what they heard from others because Mark 14:50 says "they ALL have fled and foresook him" when Jesus was arrested.

    The following questions are Sparko quedtions;

    Scenario 1: Disciples on the road think Jesus died, but he didn't. They don't recognize him because?

    Scenario 2: Disciples on the road think Jesus died, and he did but was resurrected. They don't recognize him because?
    I am thinking there is a language problem here because your answers show you don't understand what we are saying.

    If your friends thought you were dead and you were faking and showed up and said "surprise! I am not dead" would they not recognize you? Of course they would recognize you.

    If your friends thought you were dead and you really WERE dead but you came back to life would the not recognize you? Of course they would.

    Recognizing Jesus had nothing to do with whether he was resurrected or not.

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  • Sparko
    replied
    Originally posted by Hakeem View Post
    Sparko asking " If they would have recognized him if he was resurrected after they thought he was dead, then why would they not recognize him if he didn't die? " is the most plausible answer is that Jesus was in disguise in public* in light of the following two fact that (1) his disciples were not able to know it was Jesus who was talking, walking, eating and spending night with them in Luke 24 and (2) Jesus never showed himself once to one of his alleged killers of the Jews and Romans when Jesus should have appeared to these sinners because Jesus said in Mark 2:17 "I come not to the righteous but to the sinner"

    I donot understand your other two questions.
    I am trying to find out why claiming they did not recognize Jesus seems to be something you are using to argue that he was not resurrected. I see no difference in whether he was resurrected or not in whether the disciples would or would not recognize him.

    If he was in disguise, then why? Why would he lie about his appearance? Why would he disguise himself then run around for 40 days showing himself to everyone proving he is alive?

    Leave a comment:

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