Commentary thread - Hakeem vs. Boxing Pythagoras - did Jesus die on the cross?

[Sparko]

Moses face shined when he saw God - he did not die but went back down the mountain to deliver the commandments

[Cerebrum123]

Moses face shined when he saw God - he did not die but went back down the mountain to deliver the commandments

I think he's talking about when Moses and Elijah appeared at the Transfiguration, but you guys are talking about the Exodus.

[Christianbookworm]

I think he's talking about when Moses and Elijah appeared at the Transfiguration, but you guys are talking about the Exodus.

Oh! Didn't realize that. I just thought of glowy human. Anyways, Jesus wasn't dead at the transfiguration either. Elijah was reportedly taken somewhere alive. I'm not sure what happened to him later.

[Same Hakeem]

To know if Jesus was resurrected while on earth, we need to search the scriptures if Jesus body was raised in glory (1 Corinthians 15:43) that is like the man from heaven (1 Corinthians 15:49) who shines like the sun (Matthew 13:43) in light of the fact that "His (Jesus) face is shining like the sun in its brilliance" in heaven according to Revelation 1:16.

Had Jesus been dead and resutrected in glory as describled in the Bible, the disciples should have recongnised Jesus IMMEDIATELY. However, this was not the case.

[Christianbookworm]

To know if Jesus was resurrected while on earth, we need to search the scriptures if Jesus body was raised in glory (1 Corinthians 15:43) that is like the man from heaven (1 Corinthians 15:49) who shines like the sun (Matthew 13:43) in light of the fact that "His (Jesus) face is shining like the sun in its brilliance" in heaven according to Revelation 1:16.

Had Jesus been dead and resutrected in glory as describled in the Bible, the disciples should have recongnised Jesus IMMEDIATELY. However, this was not the case.

How can someone recognize Jesus if He chooses to not let them recognize Him? He can apparently keep their brains from making the connection. He can also enter a locked room by showing up inside of it. Without knocking or making a different entrance.

[Cerebrum123]

To know if Jesus was resurrected while on earth, we need to search the scriptures if Jesus body was raised in glory (1 Corinthians 15:43) that is like the man from heaven (1 Corinthians 15:49) who shines like the sun (Matthew 13:43) in light of the fact that "His (Jesus) face is shining like the sun in its brilliance" in heaven according to Revelation 1:16.

Had Jesus been dead and resutrected in glory as describled in the Bible, the disciples should have recongnised Jesus IMMEDIATELY. However, this was not the case.

So you think Moses was resurrected while on earth during the Exodus?

[rogue06]

I am trying to find out why claiming they did not recognize Jesus seems to be something you are using to argue that he was not resurrected. I see no difference in whether he was resurrected or not in whether the disciples would or would not recognize him.

If he was in disguise, then why? Why would he lie about his appearance? Why would he disguise himself then run around for 40 days showing himself to everyone proving he is alive?

One thing to consider is that while being prepared for burial (or being entombed) Jesus would have had his head and beard shaved off in accordance with Jewish law. I don't know about you but I've known a couple men who were very hard to recognize after they shaved their beards, especially if you had never seen them without one.

Just food for thought.

[Same Hakeem]

The answer to Christianbookworm question " How can someone recognize Jesus if He chooses to not let them recognize Him?" is true that Jesus did not identify himself immediately in public as was the case on the way to Emmaus. Otherwise, Jews would have ensured that he is dead. This explains Jesus not appearing once to even only one of his alleged killers of the Jews and the Romans because Jesus told us he came to the sinners not to the righteous as per Mark 2:17.

Writing " He can also enter a locked room by showing up inside of it. Without knocking or making a different entrance" is not found in the bible. Actually Jesus denied to be a spirit in Luke 24:39.

[Christianbookworm]

The answer to Christianbookworm question " How can someone recognize Jesus if He chooses to not let them recognize Him?" is true that Jesus did not identify himself immediately in public as was the case on the way to Emmaus. Otherwise, Jews would have ensured that he is dead. This explains Jesus not appearing once to even only one of his alleged killers of the Jews and the Romans because Jesus told us he came to the sinners not to the righteous as per Mark 2:17.

Writing " He can also enter a locked room by showing up inside of it. Without knocking or making a different entrance" is not found in the bible. Actually Jesus denied to be a spirit in Luke 24:39.

You are making no sense. There are even fictional characters who can pull off the getting into a room through other means than a window, door, or property damage by phasing through the wall or teleporting and they aren't ghosts either. Jesus is more awesome than a mere fictional character. How else did He show up in the locked room?

John 20:19New International Version (NIV)
Jesus Appears to His Disciples

19 On the evening of that first day of the week, when the disciples were together, with the doors locked for fear of the Jewish leaders, Jesus came and stood among them and said, “Peace be with you!”

[Sparko]

One thing to consider is that while being prepared for burial (or being entombed) Jesus would have had his head and beard shaved off in accordance with Jewish law. I don't know about you but I've known a couple men who were very hard to recognize after they shaved their beards, especially if you had never seen them without one.

Just food for thought.

good point.

[Sparko]

I think he's talking about when Moses and Elijah appeared at the Transfiguration, but you guys are talking about the Exodus.

Well the bible pretty much says that Jesus was doing the shining, not so much Moses and Elija, does that mean Jesus was resurrected then before he even died, Hakeem?

Mark 9:2 After six days Jesus took Peter, James and John with him and led them up a high mountain, where they were all alone. There he was transfigured before them. 3 His clothes became dazzling white, whiter than anyone in the world could bleach them. 4 And there appeared before them Elijah and Moses, who were talking with Jesus.

Matthew 17:17 After six days Jesus took with him Peter, James and John the brother of James, and led them up a high mountain by themselves. 2 There he was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as the light. 3 Just then there appeared before them Moses and Elijah, talking with Jesus.

[JimL]

Well the bible pretty much says that Jesus was doing the shining, not so much Moses and Elija, does that mean Jesus was resurrected then before he even died, Hakeem?

Mark 9:2 After six days Jesus took Peter, James and John with him and led them up a high mountain, where they were all alone. There he was transfigured before them. 3 His clothes became dazzling white, whiter than anyone in the world could bleach them. 4 And there appeared before them Elijah and Moses, who were talking with Jesus.

Matthew 17:17 After six days Jesus took with him Peter, James and John the brother of James, and led them up a high mountain by themselves. 2 There he was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his clothes became as white as the light. 3 Just then there appeared before them Moses and Elijah, talking with Jesus.

Where did Moses And Elijah come from?

[Sparko]

Where did Moses And Elijah come from?

Canada.

[Bill the Cat]

Where did Moses And Elijah come from?

Well, when a mommy Jew and a daddy Jew really like each other....

[Same Hakeem]

The answer to Sparko question " Well the bible pretty much says that Jesus was doing the shining, not so much Moses and Elija, does that mean Jesus was resurrected then before he even died, Hakeem?" lies in the fact that the resurrected must have 4 qualities together as follows;

1. It is buried in corruption but raised in incorruption (1Corinthians 15:42)

2. It is raised in glory

(1Corinthians 15:43)

3. It is raised in power

(1Corinthians 15:43)

5. It will changed

(1Corinthians 15:51)

When we read scriptures we find that Jesus did not have all above qualities of the resurrected.